[0:00]Haley, thank you very much indeed for joining us. Um, I I am slightly wary of probing too much about your own experience um, for obvious reasons. So,
[0:11]can you tell me why have you decided to speak out and to speak to the media? >> Well, I've been speaking out about Jeffrey Epste and his crimes for a bit
[0:22]now, a bit of time. And it's important that we keep having these conversations and speaking out and speaking on this matter because this is not um this is
[0:32]not a matter or an issue that only directly affects one country. This is a global pandemic that we're dealing with when it comes to abuse and sex
[0:41]trafficking. And we need all ears on deck and everybody should be paying attention. >> And do you feel let down? I feel incredibly let down and
[0:52]disappointed. >> I mean, who do you feel most let down by? >> The adults, the government, the DOJ,
[1:04]this administration >> because you you voted for Trump, didn't you? Um, with hopes. Um, what did you hope would happen? >> Well, it's kind of a bit of a tough
[1:16]predicament, I suppose. Uh, a few of us voted for this administration in the hopes that Trump would fulfill his promise to not just the survivors but to
[1:27]America that he was going to be the transparent administration and he was going to release all of the documents. I mean, that's what he campaigned on. And
[1:37]when you've been in this for so long and you've seen administration after administration come in and not one administration is speaking on it, not one administration is acknowledging us.
[1:48]And then you have a president that comes in and says, "Well, we're going to be transparent and we're going to lay down the law and we're going to release the documents." It sparks a bit of hope in you and that light becomes reignited.
[1:59]And so I think I was just hoping that he was going to stick to his promises and he was going to release the files. And do you feel this is a cover up still?
[2:08]>> Thousand% it's a cover up. >> And and what makes you say that? >> Well, it's kind of the back and forth
[2:18]and the contradiction of in 2024 we're going to release the files and then his entire administration, the DOJ, Cash Patel, Pam Bondi. I mean, they've all been very supportive of being
[2:29]transparent and going to the lengths of saying, "Hey, I'm Pam Bondi. I've got Bestein files and the client list on my desk and then all of a sudden that didn't happen. So obviously to the naked
[2:40]eye it looks like there's a cover up that you guys are hiding information from the public. >> Yeah. What are you comfortable telling people about what happened to you? How
[2:51]you met Epstein and and how you were part of this network of abuse, this this grooming gang as it were?
[3:02]Yeah. I mean, listen, it's a terrible place to be in to be involved with Jeffrey Epstein on any on in any perspective. As a victim, it's really,
[3:12]really hard. I mean, what we endured is diabolical. And what the DOJ and what the government's doing us to us now is
[3:22]even worse, far worseer. Um, and far more worse in my opinion. And um you know it's it's it's it's difficult to be in this position when you just want to move on.
[3:31]>> Yes. Um what can you say about what actually happened to you? >> I was recruited um as a high school
[3:43]student in 2002 by Tony Figareroa and a 16-year-old classmate. And they took me to Jeffrey's house and
[3:52]what I was told was not what happened. I was sexually abused for an entire hour upstairs um in his bathroom
[4:02]and after the hour of sexual abuse um he brought out sex toys and he thought that he was going to use those on me and when I became extremely
[4:13]uncomfortable and I told him you know I'm just not comfortable with that. That's that's I've never even experienced at 16 years old. I didn't even know what that was, you know, and
[4:24]so yeah, you know, he made me do things to him in that hour and he touched me in very inappropriate
[4:35]places and then finished. He finished himself and made me do things to him to help him get sexual gratification. And when that was finished, you could
[4:46]see the disappointment on his face and he gave me an ultimatum. either you're going to massage me and come back every time I call or you're bringing someone to me and that's just it.
[4:57]>> So he was forcing you to go out and get other girls. >> Correct. >> And I mean you presumably felt like you had
[5:09]no choice. >> I didn't have a choice. I was terrified in that room. I knew that if I screamed, if I ran for the door, what was the probability that someone was going to
[5:20]hear me when all the adults were downstairs? If I did try to get out of that room, was it locked? Was I going to be trapped? Was he going to force himself on me? I wasn't sure what the
[5:31]repercussions were going to be. >> What did you know about who he was? >> Oh, I knew nothing. He lied to me. He
[5:40]told me he worked for Nassau. And when I questioned him on working for Nassau, cuz I thought that was a bit strange that you would work for Nassau and you'd be living here in a mansion, it just it
[5:50]didn't make a lot of sense to me and then he told me he was a scientist and that I believed. He said he was a scientist working with NASA. And at that
[6:00]time, I only knew him by Jeffrey. And when he told me he was a scientist that was working with NASA, at that point I was like, "Okay, well maybe that that I could see that's where his wealth came
[6:10]from." I mean, it wasn't until two years after I got away from him, I literally had to move to Orlando to get away. Uh, that's when I started finding out during
[6:19]the investigation that no, he was allegedly a financiier and a very wealthy, powerful person.
[6:29]>> And and when you were told, you know, that he had to bring other people, you had to bring other people to him, what did you tell them about what they
[6:38]were going to do? the same thing that was told to me which was bring your friends you know it's a massage
[6:50]and at that time I didn't realize what was happening at 16 years old I wasn't capable of understanding what was actually happening in that moment I mean
[7:00]Jeffrey Epstein can sell snow to an Eskimo is what I'm learning and if Jeffrey Epstein can embezzle money and
[7:11]can manipulate grown powerful adults in the political realm and in other realms. Why would he not be able to manipulate or hurt me?
[7:23]>> I mean, you you were a child. Um, >> I was 16. >> Yeah. I mean, your your understanding of what was going on must have been pretty
[7:31]limited and manipulated. >> Correct. And then I found out from the girls that I brought to Jeffrey's house that they
[7:41]also too had to bring girls to Jeffrey's house. So it was a sex pyramid scheme. And this is why Jeffrey was so capable of
[7:51]escaping by for so long without getting caught was because his hands were clean procuring children. Because what the
[8:02]evidence, the files and depositions prove is that he used children to sexually abuse and then to use them to
[8:11]procure more children to bring to him. And that was made public, I believe, a couple years ago when Governor Dantis released all the documents on a state
[8:23]level in Florida and the judge came out and said it was the most diabolical, horrendous cycle of abuse using children to bring other children to him and it was intentional
[8:34]>> and that's how he escaped by. >> And were your interactions only with him or other people in his network? I only met Jeffrey Epstein. Um, I only
[8:46]dealt with him and his assistant directly. Um, I did see other models and women at the house, but I never saw
[8:57]powerful men or anybody else that would be implicated in the files. I mean, this is one of the things that, you know, is is slightly confusing that what we
[9:06]haven't seen a great deal of um with some obviously notable and high-profile exceptions is the victims naming other
[9:16]people in the in the Epstein network, the names that we have now seen in the papers. Can you explain that?
[9:26]I mean, to be quite honest with you, a lot of us victims and survivors, as these documents are coming to light in the public, we're learning about this
[9:36]for the first time ourselves. I was not trafficked or lent out to any of his friends. So, I personally only know of the names that I've heard
[9:48]circulating throughout the survivors and what the DOJ is now releasing. I am extremely appalled. >> And how for you did it come to an end?
[9:58]>> It hasn't come to an end. >> I I mean the the specific abuse of Epstein. >> I left him. I turned 18.
[10:11]Um, and at that point I wanted to move away and start fresh because when I met Jeffrey, I had already been raped and
[10:22]that was my first experience with a man. And when I met Jeffrey, we had conversations about my health, about my rape. I was under the impression that he was going to help me
[10:33]get justice for that. And when I turned 18, I realized two years later, I'm in the same position. Nobody's helping me.
[10:42]And I didn't like the way that it felt. So, I moved to Orlando, Florida. >> And did you feel at the time that you
[10:52]you were a survivor of crime of his crimes? You know, did did you consider going to the police at that point?
[11:03]I did not go to the police because I was in fear that there were going to be retributions if I did go to the police.
[11:10]So, I did not report him. I just disappeared and moved away and tried to forget it ever happened.
[11:20]>> When did this then catch up with you again? because you you then uh you know became uh a victim again in that you
[11:29]were then accused as well. Correct. So during the investigation there were a lot of slanderous smear
[11:41]campaigns that Jeffrey Epstein his attorneys coming to find out in the Epstein files. I was thrown into the media. I was labeled a lot of different
[11:52]things, including a recruiter, which to me is surprising because I did not do anything different or unordinary than
[12:02]the other survivors did. The only way this sex network pyramid scheme was able to work the way it worked was because
[12:14]all of us brought girls to Jeffy's house. He did not bring those girls. They were brought by each other. So to see this in the tabloids and the smear
[12:24]campaigns about how I was a recruiter, it was very disappointing. But it was a smear campaign. And that's when I started getting traction back in the media. And you know, unfortunately for
[12:35]me, I was placed in some categories that were very unfitting and unfair, come to learn. And I was dragged back in it shortly after that when he was
[12:46]rearrested again, I believe in 2019 in New York. And all of the survivors, including myself, were given subpoenas. And we had to go back through the whole
[12:58]process again and telling our stories to about 50 different people all over again. FBI agents, sex crime. I mean, it
[13:08]was just chaotic. And that's really when traction started to pick up again about Jeffrey Epstein. And that's when I was back in the news and back into the
[13:18]treading media that was out daily. But this time I was uh seen as a as as a survivor and as a victim as I as I've always been.
[13:28]>> And and and I mean can you explain to me what that is like? I mean, you know, a a lot of survivors of sex crimes are are unable to um give their testimony and
[13:40]unable to talk to investigators because it's too traumatic. Um how how were you able to deal with that?
[13:49]And in retrospect, uh how would you describe it? It's this feeling of hopelessness like
[14:02]you're being gutted from the inside out and it's very much like an outof body experience that you go through and you
[14:11]feel very isolated, alienated, you feel alone. Um you feel hopeless. You start idealizing suicide. you start having
[14:23]um these deep dark emotions that kind of consume you for a while. You kind of get sucked into this black hole of despair and it's very traumatic. But
[14:34]I think I was so hellbent and so focused on proving to the world and to myself that I'm a victim of sex abuse by this man. And what he did to me after the sex
[14:46]abuse is so diabolical. and not just did it to me, he did it to he did it to many victims with the smear campaign. And so I was willing to go to war and rage war
[14:55]on anybody who tried to smear my name, take me down, call me a liar, tell me that I'm crazy because this is a crazy salacious story. Nobody will believe
[15:06]you. And I was just I guess my ego stepped in a little bit in my survival mode and said, "No, you're going to talk about this. You're going to get through this and we're going to see this day."
[15:17]What what was the accountability you wanted >> at that time? I wanted to look Jeffrey in his face
[15:28]and ask him to see me for what he did to me. But as the investigation developed, I realized that Jeffrey is not a person
[15:39]who is somebody that can be held accountable. And we're seeing that through the government and the DOJ with the release of the Epstein files and the verbiage and language and material
[15:48]that's in those files are so um salacious and evil and um
[15:58]now for accountability for me I'm seeing it. I had such a broader image of what it looked like to me to have accountability and seeing other
[16:09]governments other governments opening up investigations into the Epstein files to figure out where their government stands. This is what I'm talking about.
[16:19]This is the change that I want to see, not just for America, but for the world. Everybody should be delving into those files and figuring out who is is implicated and what governments are now
[16:31]implicated in those files. >> Did did you ever come across Gileain Maxwell and and do you feel that her imprisonment gives you any accountability? >> You know, that's a tough question. So,
[16:45]I've never met Golain Maxwell. Um, and I think that was deliberate. But I think for me, when she first got arrested, I did feel like there was
[16:57]accountability. I was like, finally, finally, people are are taking action. But then when the president of the United States and Todd Blanch move her
[17:07]to a summer camp and then give her a two-hour interview, it's just like, what is going on? What did I miss? This does not any longer feel like accountability. It feels more like another cover up.
[17:18]>> And if you could speak to her before she testifies uh to Congress, what would you say? >> I have nothing to say to her. I have nothing to say to her. I think the only
[17:30]thing I would really like to throw in her face. There was a comment she made on a recording of a deposition where she
[17:40]says she slept with Jeffrey Epstein one time because he had a heart condition or health issues. And when I heard that, my my mouth dropped the floor because I'm like, um,
[17:52]Gain, you helped procure girls for Jeffrey Epstein. Just to be clear, he wasn't interested in you at all, which is why he was molesting and raping and
[18:02]trafficking young girls. That's all I have to say to her. when it comes to the administration that you you feel so let down by. I mean, obviously, Trump's attitude towards women is
[18:14]something that we have known for years and years since long before you decided to vote for him. Um, you know, are you are you at all really
[18:24]surprised about what happened? I am surprised the files are displaying the material they're displaying because
[18:34]if you go back 101 15 years ago, there was a lot of conspiracy theories about adicome children being trafficked to
[18:44]islands, rape, pedophilia, cannibalism. There was a lot of conspiracy theories that were out there years ago and I tried my hardest to stay away from those
[18:56]conspiracy theories, but with the Epstein files coming to light, they're not really conspiracy theories, are they? >> And and how how do you feel about Trump
[19:08]specifically now? I can't say it wouldn't be appropriate for me to use that language on this kind of platform,
[19:19]but I think it's fair to say that uh I have nothing nice to say about him, this administration. I do not wish him well. And you know where justice is not
[19:30]present or it won't prevail, you're going to have judgment day come very soon when you go to meet God and you will have a lot to answer for and you're not going to heaven.
[19:42]>> I mean what what is you know one of the things that is really shocking about the allegations and obviously not a lot is proven yet is the extent you know how many people were apparently involved
[19:52]with Epstein. Um what do you think of these people? I mean are are they um are they normal or are they some
[20:04]>> they're not normal? >> You know there's what I mean is there's so many of them that is this kind of behavior has it been normalized you know
[20:13]or are they some weird group of people with with weird tastes and weird senses of morality?
[20:23]Oh, this is so beyond a personality trait of being weird. This is these these are evil human beings who
[20:35]are trying to normalize society into accepting pedophilia and trafficking. And it's the
[20:46]uh language of people like Megan Kelly and other uh influencers who say things like, "Well, they're not 5 years old, so
[20:57]it wasn't pedophilia." I want to be very clear. If you are a teenager, you are still considered a minor child. and young
[21:08]women and children are not for sex, rape or trafficking or exploitation. These people are severely severely
[21:19]demented. And even if you are associated with Jeffrey Epstein, you should be investigated. Absolutely. And through those investigations,
[21:28]we could learn who actually abused and and are responsible and those who aren't. But the people that who aren't directly abusing these children, women,
[21:40]and trafficking like myself, I feel like you're complicit in knowing the fact that he was doing this, which is just as awful. And I saw a video and my mouth
[21:50]dropped of Cindy McCain. It was either a panel or an interview where she says, "Of course we all knew what Jeffrey Epstein was doing. Nobody wanted to go against him in the legal realm." And
[22:02]that to me was really hard to hear because it's really atrocious that how many adults adults who have their own children did not stand up for us and sat
[22:12]in silence. Where's your backbone? Where's your humanity? >> One of the things we've heard in Britain from uh a lot of the victims of grooming gangs is that they felt that the
[22:24]authorities treated them like trash. you know, they they regarded them as teenage prostitutes. Um, is that how you feel
[22:34]you've been treated as well? >> Correct. And in the investigation in 2008 or 2009 into Jeffrey Epstein when he got caught here in Florida,
[22:46]his attorneys with the smear campaign called us underage children, prostitutes, and I don't want to use the other word for this platform, but it was very um it dismantled our mental health
[22:57]is what they did. And I do feel like we've been treated like that. And when you really start healing and going to therapy and learning what was happening
[23:06]to you, grooming is a technique that abusers use and it is very hard to prove in court. >> And do you feel with the publication of
[23:17]the documents so far that things are finally turning your way? >> I felt like that before the documents
[23:26]ever came out. Um I felt for a very long time. I've done a lot of work in bringing light to this situation. I did Filthy Rich. I've told my story on so
[23:36]many platforms and I think the conversation around Jeffrey Epstein has evolved
[23:45]tremendously for survivors. >> Obviously, you you must know Britain is gripped by the Mandlesson scandal. Uh this very senior figure in the British
[23:55]government and at one time the US ambassador. um who who says he was never involved in any of this uh and didn't
[24:05]know about it. Um do you think it was possible to know Epstein and to not realize what he was about?
[24:15]>> No. No, I don't think it's possible to have a relationship with somebody as um disgusting as Jeffrey Epstein and not
[24:25]know that this is what he was doing. I mean surely in his uh realm and circles of political figures and Hollywood um
[24:35]actors and actresses I I definitely think in those communities and in those realms he was known for what he was doing. Kind of hard to hide the fact that you like children.
[24:46]Um, and what did you think of Virginia Dupre's um campaign and actions to try and uh bring Prince Andrew to account as he
[24:56]was? I get emotional every time I talk about Virginia. Um, Virginia was a light for a lot of us and
[25:13]she's an American hero. She wasn't perfect, but she was an American hero who against all odds
[25:22]brought campaign to bring down some of the most powerful people in the world. And it cost her her life.
[25:33]It costed her her life. And so for me, she will always be on a pedestal. She's incredible. She's fearless against
[25:44]all odds at the cost of her life. She dedicated her life to bringing down the most powerful people in the world just for a little bit of justice. And she was
[25:55]a light for a lot of us. >> And and do you think what has happened to Andrew Mountbatton Windsor as he's
[26:03]now called is justice? what he did to Virginia
[26:17]doesn't even equate justice. You know, like like I said, it cost her her life. So, there is no justice for Virginia in that
[26:28]matter. But, as the other survivors are sitting back and seeing this, I know if she were here, she would be cheering us on. And this is exactly the kind of
[26:38]justice that she was waiting for. >> I'm sorry. I'm sorry to upset you with these questions. I I want to um bring
[26:48]you bring you back to one other other matter which is to do with the scandal in British politics at the moment. um you know one one of the things that seems to have happened with a lot of people who were involved with Epstein is
[26:59]that um it was known that they had had a you know interaction or friendship or whatever it was with him but they they were then they have been allowed to just
[27:08]carry on with their lives uh and say well we weren't involved with that. Um, in the case of Mandlesson, he carried on being involved with
[27:19]Epstein as a friend after he had been found guilty of trying to procure child um, prostitution as it was described in the
[27:30]case. Um, what do you think of a society that enables people to carry on in their
[27:39]roles in in in high levels of the establishment uh and sort of forgive them for their past associations? >> Well, it's a dual system that we're
[27:54]seeing. So, it's do as I say, not as I do type of situation with the governments across the country, um, across the world. Um,
[28:05]it's horrendous that these people even get to just walk around as if, you know, they're untouchable and to be able to have a future and to be able to go to
[28:16]work and to be able to live a life and and the survivors don't get that, you know. So it feels like Lady Justice is imbalanced right now and we need to
[28:28]bring that balance back to not just America but to every country across the world and there should never be an imbalance or an abuse of power.
[28:38]Government is here to protect the constituents to protect the people and um we we just we don't see that. It's not
[28:49]what's happening. Hey there Robson, thank you very much indeed for your time. Thank you for talking to us. And again, I'm sorry to upset you with some of the questions, but uh we appreciate your time. >> Okay.
[28:59]>> Thank you for having me.