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[0:11]at this point the court is not respond or remain as currently set with related thereto there's also a currently a
[0:21]preliminary hearing that is set for August 3rd and 4th it's my understanding that we're going to continue forward with that preliminary hearing as
[0:31]anticipated is that correct mr. wood yes your honor mr. Pryor at this time judge that is
[0:41]correct but the question is will we see it welcome to long crime now everybody I'm Jessie Webber and thanks for joining us so the prosecutor in this case Rob wood
[0:51]has asked the court to ban video recordings of the upcoming preliminary hearings for Laurie valide Bell and her husband Chad both are been charged with evidence tampering related counts in
[1:02]connection with this discovery of Laurie's children Ty Lee and JJ who were found buried in Chad's backyard he also want a fun fact to talk about in Laurie
[1:12]and Chad's belief system July 22nd 2020 is the day of the apocalypse when there will only be a few thousand people left on earth now we were afraid if we would
[1:24]have a show so far we're okay we'll see which way this goes I want to bring in my panel I'm joined by law and crime legal analyst Terry Austin and Julie rendom and of course want to talk about the Laurie valo case executive trial
[1:36]producer Kathy Russin is with me great to have everybody here Kathy I want to start with you great that we have a show we were concerned but let's talk about this the idea you know is one thing to
[1:46]read about a case we'll see pictures of a courtroom but the idea of not having these preliminary hearings recorded what do you make of that what do you think
[1:57]the public reaction would be to that well it's interesting because prosecutor Rob Wood is saying that he's going to have a hard time seating juries in both
[2:07]these cases if the elimin airy hearings are broadcast and live streamed I mean look I hate to tell you Rob wood there's nobody in this country that hasn't heard
[2:19]at least something about this case especially in the entire state of it really doesn't matter what county they're inundated with this case so I'm not sure that that's going to matter at
[2:29]this point I know people are furious right now that it's a possibility we may not build a broadcast the preliminary hearing now remember the judge hasn't ruled yet
[2:39]the one thing that going in our favor to be able to see it and show it to everyone is COBIT Cove in 19 that Judge can't really let all the media and
[2:49]public into the courtroom so he's likely going to have to let it feed go out it's going to be a matter of one can we broadcast it to can we record it so it could be viewed later and those are all
[3:00]things the judge is gonna have to take into consideration either way I will be there in Idaho for the first literary here you know August 30 yeah we're to have no doubt that you
[3:10]would be there Kathy now Terry from a legal point of view which way is the judge decide on this because there are a lot of people watching this there are these kinds of First Amendment issues as
[3:20]well and so you tell me where is the judge likely to rule on whether or not these hearings which by the way I have to tell you we've all been waiting for because there's a ton of information that investigators have not revealed yet
[3:32]and we're all kind of an a guessing game to determine what they have that we're supposed to be revealed or going to be revealed at these preliminary hearings so which way is the judge gonna rule well if I had to guess Jesse I would say
[3:43]the judge would rule in favor of having the cameras and the livestream and the reason is this the prosecution in its motion actually acknowledged the fact
[3:53]that defendants have a Sixth Amendment right to a fair trial and a public hearing so I think therein lies the issue the right to have a public trial
[4:04]and a fair hearing is born the out way I think the fact that the prosecution does not believe it can get a partial a jury who is going to be fair here and it's a
[4:15]Kathy point everybody knows about this case so I don't think that you know that will help so let's talk about that Julie
[4:25]how on earth can you get a jury that either doesn't know about this case or hasn't formed an opinion of his case I remember we were covering Harvey Weinstein that became almost an impossible task but here in this low
[4:36]community work everybody seems to know about this what would be potential solutions to get a fair and impartial jury for both chad de bal and lori valide Bell so I mean the first
[4:48]possibility is to have the hearing the preliminary hearing not you know you know not video recorded and just you know just to go back to that for just one second you know we compared it to a
[4:59]grand jury proceeding a grand jury proceeding in New York would be a secret proceeding that would be the one proceeding in which the public is not allowed to in a sense see it obviously
[5:10]preliminary hearing is different because it's done in a public forum and I do agree with Kathy that I think kovat makes it a little easier for the judge's decision because it's hard to keep a
[5:21]hearing in which it's done you know you know and more of a virtual sense private with that said I think the options are you know to move it to another jurisdiction which I'm not sure we can
[5:32]move it to any jurisdiction similar to Harvey Weinstein I think you'd have to move it off the planet in order for people to not know about it but I will say people that are watching this case
[5:42]or jurors don't have to not know about the case they have to be willing to take whatever their opinion is or isn't and separate it from the evidence that
[5:52]they're going to hear in this case yeah no that's a good point look it's something that people have strong opinions about and if we take a
[6:02]step back the last time we saw Laurie valid a bail was when she was in court regarding the misdemeanor charges she faces in Madison County remember she's facing charges in two different counties
[6:13]felonies in Fremont but if we go to Madison the judge in this case actually lowered her bail not that it matters because she still has one million-dollar bail in Fremont County and clearly she
[6:24]hasn't put that up but listen to the judge here talking about what the conditions of her release would be of Justice Ms day bail is considered
[6:35]innocent until proven guilty but every court in Idaho in consideration of what
[6:44]bond should be set is it's allowed to consider the likelihood of conviction and any mitigating or
[6:55]aggravating factors that may bear on that likelihood I think it's escapable that these misdemeanor charges are
[7:05]relating to the whereabouts of her minor children who have now been found
[7:10]deceased all of the other factors are
[7:25]really no different than where they were when we had this last hearing I am going to reduce bond based on my consideration
[7:33]of all those factors I'm going to set bond $50,000 on each count for a total of one hundred and fifty thousand
[7:43]dollars in bond if Miss de bel does post bond I'm adding an additional condition to her relief that she have no contact
[7:52]whatsoever with her alleged co-conspirators Kathy no contact with
[8:01]Chad did that strike you as odd and also as we try to understand Chad and Laura's relationship my understanding is you're learning more details about Laurie's past relationships so if you can speak
[8:12]about these points I think that would really help viewers I don't know if it's that the judge ordered that because when you have conspiracy charges they don't want them speaking to each
[8:22]other one thing we know is those two are two peas in a pod they're pretty connected they're not going to turn on each other anytime soon that could change down the road I don't
[8:33]see it happening we've learned a little bit more of Lori's we've gone over some before some of her divorce documents with previous husbands and today I read
[8:42]some more her second husband remember she has chats her fifth husband and what what we see is a theme every I haven't read her first husband so now I know
[8:53]information about number two three and four and she's accused all of them being physically abusive to her emotionally abusive to her and some even worse things on some of them
[9:04]now I guess that is possible that women can keep with the same pattern and keep marrying the same type of bad guy but it does seem like she's always a victim in
[9:13]all of her marriages mm-hmm how convenient let me ask you a question here Terry you know we talked about it on every show neither Chad nor Lori have been charged
[9:24]with murder as of this point now what do you think investigators theory is about what who is involved in what because if I'm understanding the charges correctly is it not that Chad and perhaps Alec
[9:36]Scott who is Laurie's brother were instrumental in disposing the bodies but Laurie was not Laurie maybe didn't physically dispose the bodies but was instrumental in trying to cover it up
[9:48]you tell me how what investigators are thinking about the roles of either of these defendants at this point I think based on the evidence so far the authorities are thinking that alex is
[9:59]the one who actually killed both day-day and Ty Lee and that chad was the one who helped dispose of the body Lori I believe and I think the authorities
[10:10]think was behind the whole scheme and actually got her brother Alex to do the bad beat but the problem is they haven't charged either Laurie or Chad yet and
[10:21]I'm not quite sure just what they are waiting for they found the bodies they have all of the connections in the theory so I'm waiting for them to
[10:31]actually bring the murder charges and look Alex Cox Alex Cox is the see so clearly they can't go after him tell you what I'm hoping that these hearings are
[10:41]recorded we need to see what's going on we're gonna wait because this is something that people want answers to and we're gonna cover it here on Long croc when we come back more to talk about and we're going to start with
[10:51]Elaine Maxwell Bunch updates there stay tuned [Music] miscellaneous well is in prison and so a
[11:08]lot of people want to know if she's going to turn in powerful people I know you talked in the past about Prince Andrew and you criticize Bill Clinton's behavior I'm wondering idea do you feel that she's going to turn into powerful
[11:20]men how do you see that working out I don't know I haven't really been following it too much I just wish it well frankly I've met her numerous times over the years especially since I lived
[11:30]in Palm Beach and I guess they lived in Palm Beach but I wish her well whatever it is I don't know the situation with Prince Andrew just don't know not aware of it well that's
[11:41]certainly a curious statement regarding a woman who's facing a six count indictment for allegedly luring and enticing underage girls for sexual abuse and then lying about it back there were
[11:52]Julie and Terri Julie your reaction to that because I've read a bunch of comments and there's everything from Trump's trying to protect himself he doesn't know what glean Maxwell has on
[12:03]him by this comment he's signalling to her that if she were to be convicted of federal crimes he might pardon her your view are people reading too much into this or is this perhaps he just wasn't
[12:14]prepared for this calm this question you know I think my favorite line was when he says I guess they lived in Palm Beach of course they lived near him he knew
[12:24]them he knew Jeffrey Epstein he knew her as well I think he's never with all due respect to our president I don't think he's ever really prepared for questions that are asked of him so this is nothing
[12:34]new I don't think I think we're reading too far into it when we start to say that you know it's a sign that he's going to pardon her anything like that it's a flip comment that he makes often
[12:44]about many things obviously the the situation here the allegation is that somehow President Trump along with Bill
[12:53]Clinton along with Prince Andrew they're all within this orbit they were all engaged in illegal activity that's the main allegation here now Terry I want to turn to you because there's a lot to
[13:03]focus on gillian maxwell her attorneys have requested a gag on the case citing the comments that have been made by federal officials specifically the US Attorney from the Southern District of New York
[13:15]Audrey Strauss when she was arrested when d'Alene max was arrested and they're saying these comments calling d'Alene Maxwell certain names in the media is highly prejudicial your
[13:26]thoughts on a gag order in this case being put put down by a judge I don't think that that is necessary here and I say that because I think that Strauss
[13:37]was actually quite careful in the statements that she made I think she didn't go too far sometimes we see I think the authorities or the police or
[13:48]at that press conference other officials their costs called her a snake evil and things of that nature yes now those comments I think we're too much and I do
[13:59]think you have to be careful because when you get to that point you are trying your case in the media and you could be potentially weighing you know jurors who might be sitting on the case
[14:10]so I do think that Dave might have gone too far but just itself I think she was fair and even-handed on the comment she simply said what the charges were going
[14:19]to be and I think she was as I said not going too far so it's interesting that stuff this week was mentioned because I think she specifically was the one who
[14:30]was being fair in her comments Julie let's move on to another allegation this allegation is that Ghislaine Maxwell through
[14:39]a holding company paid this far right wing conservative activist to ultimately try to get the judge removed in the case the prosecutor excuse me removed in the
[14:51]case and ultimately to have a smear campaign against the alleged victims of Epstein and Maxwell this rumor that has been circulating what are your thoughts
[15:01]on this and is does it hold any water and we obviously we don't know I mean we're hearing that she the company paid I think it was $25,000 to try to either
[15:12]a intimidate the victims and be do something to get rid of Jeffrey Berman we see what happens I don't think one has anything to do with the other I think obviously time will
[15:22]I assume the feds are gonna look into that as one other aspect because you know part of the issue of her remaining incarcerated is some concern that she would potentially go you know
[15:33]intimidate or try to intimidate witnesses or victims in this case and so that's just another piece of evidence that would support that Terry let me ask
[15:43]you real quick the judge a federal judge is also going to be determining whether glenn Maxwell's prior deposition testimony in a civil lawsuit that sealed would be released and there are some
[15:55]graphic details there about her sex life what do you think the judge is going to do here well generally speaking what they're going to do is look at whether or not the you know prejudicial value is
[16:06]going to be outweighed here whether or not it's going to be evidence that's gonna help in the trial whether its probative so I think that here you know the issues that were brought up in the
[16:17]deposition may not really be related to what's going on here at the trial so yes in fact it was under oath but whether or not it's really you know relevant for
[16:28]what's going on here and the charges that are going on here is something I think the judge is going to have to determine I was always an update in that case and will continue to follow it I want to move on to a different case that
[16:39]we've been following here on long crime now Rashard Brooks he's the man who was killed outside of a Wendy's after a police detainment police arrest gone bad now the attorney for one of the
[16:51]defendants former officer Garrett Rolf was actually charged with murder they filed a motion to have the DA Paul Howard recuse himself I'll tell you what let's actually start you can hear
[17:02]Paul Howard himself when these up Garrett Rolf as well as his partner officer Devon Brosnan were arrested take a look we have concluded that mr. Brooks
[17:14]was running away at the time that the shot was fired mr. Brooks was shot twice in the back one of the shots was a
[17:24]sinner shot to the back that penetrated his heart and it was done by a 9-millimeter Glock now one of the things that we also
[17:35]relied upon in our conclusion is something that is called under the law referred to as an excited utterance and that's when someone makes a an immediate
[17:47]statement and because it is made without the ability to consult with counsel or to think about it under the law an excited utterance is considered as
[17:57]highly reliable and at the time that the shot was fired the utterance made by
[18:05]officer Roth was I got him that was the statement that was made at that time the
[18:14]we also noted that officer Roth was firing a Taser at mr. Brooks the city of
[18:23]Atlanta SOPs in fact prohibit officers from firing tasers at someone who is running away so the city of Atlanta said
[18:33]you cannot even fire a Taser at someone who's running away so you certainly can't fire a gun a handgun at someone
[18:43]who is running away Julie let's start there my understanding is one of the reasons the defense wants the DA off this case is because they plan to call him as a witness and say you are saying
[18:55]one thing about tasers now but you said T's a another thing about Tasers only if I believe 10 days before the idea of that Brooks was not a threat to the officers and yet earlier on you said
[19:07]that a Taser was in fact a dangerous weapon they want to ask they were actually want to call them as a witness to talk about that your thoughts so you know regardless of what you think about
[19:18]the specific facts of the case I do have some problems with this DA I don't believe that many of the reasons behind there's no argument that that this DA is
[19:29]gonna be able to call this a witness it's his opinions about whether or not a Taser is a deadly weapon or not really has no bearing or relevance to the actual facts of the case however I do
[19:40]think the defense has many points in regards to the DA's behavior leading up to this investigation including his motivation I think politically in using this case to kind
[19:52]of benefit his politics and his re-election and to the fact that he himself is being investigated by the GBI for his own misconduct so I think
[20:02]there's problems with him at the end of the day I don't think the judge is going to recuse him but I think it would benefit the prosecution if he wasn't touching this case too much Terry we
[20:13]talked about this on an earlier show that as Julie said yeah he is being investigated including for his use of subpoenas his use of funds in and then how he used that to possibly supplement
[20:23]his own salary do you think at the end of the day this becomes a question he's too controversial a figure with such an important case and he may be set aside and if that's the case Terry who takes
[20:34]his place and how does that affect the further proceedings not only might he be set aside but I think because of all of
[20:44]the issues occurring the fact he's being investigated for funneling money through his own private accountant the way he looked at this educators case and and
[20:55]gave them some leniency even though they were found guilty and a plethora of other issues I think he should consider stepping down himself and setting himself aside and so your second
[21:06]question there are many other DA's who could take the case he could still be behind the scenes but as far as a public front they could put another investigator we've seen in other cases
[21:17]particularly in Georgia where they go from one and best prosecutor to another so I think that they could do that in this case and it might bode well for the prosecution if they did that I believe
[21:29]these are the conversations that are being had right now because again there's so much at stake here there's a lot of important factors here and it should be noted that the DA's office has said that they haven't responded to this room cues emotion yet but they will at a
[21:40]later date we'll take a break when we come back we'll focus on an update in Elijah Maclean's case stay tuned [Music]
[22:12][Music] [Laughter] that's Elijah McLean the young man out
[22:25]of Colorado was detained by police given a shot of ketamine went into cardiac arrest and then died several days later now there have been no criminal charges filed against anybody in this case
[22:37]that's currently being reviewed by the state AG however there has been an update the City Council in Aurora has officially passed a resolution a measure to appoint a three-member team to
[22:48]conduct an independent investigation I want to bring in homicide detective dr. Kenneth Lange who is joining Terry and Julie dr. great to have you here
[22:58]so we see that this team is being led by Jonathan Smith who is a former DOJ lawyer he actually handled overseeing the investigation of the death of
[23:08]Michael Brown out of Ferguson and my understanding is that this team is not going to determine whether criminal charges should be filed but whether there should be changes in police tactics and policies possibly the first
[23:19]responders here how do you imagine this could play out so it's really important that we do have transparency with our investigations particularly those that
[23:31]involve police officers involved in death investigation so serving as a homicide detective had the opportunity to serve or to investigate a number of
[23:41]investigations where people had died at our hands and so when that happens it we've always welcomed in my agency the ability to
[23:52]bring in another entity and to get a different viewpoint of that investigation so with this I could see perhaps the ability of some new
[24:03]legislation coming out or an even new training tactics for officers in regards to this type of conduct you know I just want to give everybody a understanding
[24:15]of exactly what this situation looked like so I warn our viewers what you're about to see is disturbing this is the body cam footage of the arrest that's
[24:25]just the sample of what happened to Elijah but I think it's important to show [Music]
[25:14][Music] oh yeah I'll do it
[26:39]all right truly we're watching this now we understand this three member panel is being assembled that leave two of the positions have not been filled yet but
[26:49]whatever the findings of this team are as again I don't my understanding is I don't believe that they are going to be dictating whether criminal charges
[26:59]should be filed however could their findings ultimately affect the state attorney the state AG's decision to ultimately file charges against the
[27:11]officers or even a first responder absolutely I you know keep in mind I mean that there's so many questions still outstanding in this case and people want answers and obviously putting together these three individuals
[27:22]in this panel to do a further investigation is a way to get some of those answers and potentially make some changes but at the end of the day if they come up with evidence that supports
[27:32]the need for there to be criminal charges against one or any of those police officers they're going to be provided to the prosecutors and potentially the prosecutors will use that in order to go forward with
[27:43]criminal charges if they deem them appropriate right and I think you know people want answers not just for Elijah MacLean but also to our next case
[27:54]George Floyd let's go there because there's a lot to break down here the judge has officially lifted the gag order that was placed on the defense the means that the defense can now make
[28:05]statements in a public forum and remember we're talking about four officers or I should say four former officers who have been criminally charged in connection with Floyd's death now the issue of use of force is going
[28:15]to be huge for the defense and let's start right there where attorney tony romo Nucci who is actually one of the attorneys representing George Floyd's family or call that they have filed a federal civil rights lawsuit against the
[28:27]city and the officers let's listen to this idea of use of force by the police that use of force question is very important because the use of force
[28:38]police we know are allowed to use force but only commensurate with the force that is used against them that's why it's called a continuum scale and there's a scale in which you're supposed
[28:50]to follow that if somebody continues to resist or is running away or is using some sort of force against you that you're allowed to use a certain amount
[29:00]of force back but when you look at this event this event George Floyd was prone on the ground where there was force
[29:10]coming up from the ground force being pressed on his back he was compliant he was restrained therefore the force that
[29:20]the police were using turned into deadly force they didn't have to use their gun on him or a Taser or a shotgun that knee
[29:31]became deadly force with every second that ticked away every second they ticked away that was a Fourth Amendment
[29:39]violation now please keep in mind this is the civil case the burden of proof on a civil case for the Fourth Amendment is a preponderance of the evidence standard
[29:50]that means the way we explain it in court if somebody tips the scales of justice this so much we prove our case and the 14th amendment it's deliberate
[30:01]indifference it's a little bit of a different standard on the criminal case this is not the criminal case that's beyond a reasonable doubt that's a significant different standard we're not
[30:12]here to talk about the criminal case we're here to talk about the civil standards the use of force that was used against them that turned into deadly force which killed them because of
[30:24]training policies training policies that were bargained into the union contract which gives away the ability for police officers to be accountable for their behavior
[30:36]and for Minneapolis to be less transparent you're right they have a reputation for being liberal but if you don't change the use of force policies
[30:47]and and train you will have continued failures as in the death of George Floyd
[30:57]I want to go back to a retired homicide detective dr. Kenneth Liang here and we're gonna get into the judge lifting the gag order but I want to stick with this use of force because it's our understanding the court is deciding
[31:09]whether or not to publicly release the body cam footage right now people can people members of the media can actually go to a private appointment and view the footage themselves but it's not allowed
[31:20]for public dissemination however the court is considering releasing it it seems that the defense is keen on this they want it released so when we're talking about issues of did they use
[31:30]proper force here what they were trained to do and there doesn't seem to be a fear of the defense to have people view this body cam footage what's your perspective doctor
[31:41]so it seems that the defense wants to use the totality of the circumstances that from the officers perspective and they want to be able to get that out there into the public but I'm not sure that I really see how this changes the
[31:53]outcome of this potential trial in that the the use of force was excessive in the George Floyd case beyond a reasonable doubt that we are trained
[32:05]that document me ask you this let me ask you this that when the video if the videos were released from your perspective your experience what are you looking for in those videos so if they
[32:16]are eventually released we know what to look for so if the videos are released we're looking for the different perspectives to see what other viewpoints it has offer for
[32:28]if how if George was resisting or not if he was being combative in a different way I but I'm not sure really sure that we're gonna be able to see that based on
[32:38]the video that we've already seen and what we already know right and I mean look it will tell a different story because we have the transcripts but to see the vision will be a completely
[32:49]different story Terry let's move on to the gag order the judge lifted this gag order seemingly so the defense can defend themselves in a public forum was that the right decision and although the judge said look you're
[33:01]still bound by ethics rules and and what you can say what do you anticipate these defense attorneys will do now that the gag order has been lifted well it's
[33:12]interesting because it was lifted the does reason that it was lifted because both sides actually but the defense had a right to protect the interests of
[33:22]their clients and also the judge said that people were violating the gag order anyway so I found that to be interesting that the judge didn't want to enforce it
[33:33]and he just decided to give up and let the gag order resend and hopefully they will follow the law in the state and not
[33:43]you know go beyond what they're supposed to say in terms of the ethics of the situation but I did find it interesting that the judge lifted it and part of his rationale was the fact that people are
[33:55]violating it anyway Terry follow-up question were you surprised by the judge saying the Attorney General will not be held in contempt for the statement that he made
[34:06]while the announcement that he made while the gag order was in place namely saying that different members have now joined the prosecution team the defense had a big issue with that said that violated the gag order you're talking
[34:17]about now putting together this all-star team that's prejudicial if the court ruled the state a the AG did nothing wrong listen I think it made sense
[34:27]because the announcement was very benign it just said that we have additional people who are working on the case and these people are very qualified yes I suppose you could read into that that is
[34:38]saying listen we're gearing up but the point was it was a abductive statement I do think however having said that that when you have a gag or I think both defense and
[34:48]prosecution should be very careful about making any statements at all when the news keeps on coming with this case including the fact that Derrick Chauvin is now being looked into failing to pay
[35:00]taxes the case will continue to follow when we come back I want to focus on a case that we have been really really concerned with here on law and crime and that of course is the murder of Dan
[35:11]Markel big update stay tuned welcome
[35:27]back everybody finally let's get to the ongoing case of Dan Markel this is the FSU law professor who was gunned down in his garage the two killers sigfredo Garcia and Luis Rivera are currently in
[35:38]prison Rivera had pled guilty Garcia was ultimately convicted now Garcia's a former girlfriend of alleged accomplice Catherine bagdana wha she her first trial ended in a hung jury
[35:48]so she's awaiting a retrial and this is interesting because the main question here is about the Adel sins that's Dan marquel's ex-wife's family whom the
[36:00]state alleges was behind this hey yet no one in the Adelson family has been arrested or charged now as we are in the
[36:09]6-year anniversary of Dan marquel's death his friends have formed a group called justice for Dan where they're actually petitioning the state attorney
[36:18]to arrest and criminally charge the adel since the question is will that work but before we can get to that let's go to some of the evidence that we learned during the course of this trial against
[36:29]the Adel sins so Charlie Adelson Wendy Adelson's brother again the former brother-in-law of Dan Markel it's believed that he was dating Catherine
[36:39]mag bana WA and allegedly he used her as the conduit to hire the hit man I want you to listen to this wiretap recording and it's between Charlie Adelson and his
[36:49]assistant at this Dental Institute where she says authorities are trying to get wrecker for Katie because the idea here is that allegedly Charlie was paying Katie as a
[37:01]form as a working at the Dental Institute although authorities say that was just a cover he was really paying her because of the head so listen carefully to what he says
[37:10]on this wiretap recording hey she works
[37:19]here yes get there I'm not there right
[37:32]now and I'm in surgery it's not my office is my dad's office so I can't
[37:43]give anything out all right so you know I don't have access to that I don't know where anything is I would not speak to anybody mm-hmm
[37:54]I mean you could talk to everyone I couldn't say to a lot Dave right and it's not my office there's office was sold back to my dad actually over a long time ago so tell them that you'll actually you're talking to the wrong dr.
[38:06]Adel so you're not here they're within 20 days before Turkish border searches for by the burbs cars with me are they
[38:16]there now that wasn't on the back I'm in the back they're just waiting for me to come back oh and they want records yeah do me a favor I'm gonna call you from a landline on
[38:28]yourself okay okay all right now we have a recording of Charlie and Katie where they're apparently using code words and
[38:39]code language which begs the question why would you be doing that unless of course you did something illegal take a listen pick up the phone sounds personal sounds
[38:48]exactly 2001 she didn't Hey for a second she picked up the phone and dude she's in the bathroom
[38:58]and I read that was like some kind of code for something or other she's like Mike diversity in the bathroom was like my
[39:10]face like sufficiently police are trying to tell me I'll take it like to ask your
[39:19]has she flushed or utilities I wanted I want to watch Magellanic flesh okay so
[39:35]I'm fucking I thought this was like code on my key just you watch her is she in
[39:40]the bathroom then like call me back made
[39:56]it clear I want the problem okay what exactly were they talking
[40:08]about I don't know let's move on now we know that it's also alleged that Donna Adelson the matriarch of the family it is believed that she knew about the plot or was involved in the murder plot in
[40:19]some way so listen exactly to this recording of Charlie speaking to his mother about her potential role where they are talking about how the police are trying to trick them into confessing
[40:30]something take a look you've done nothing wrong it's because of that you
[40:40]have little nothing to worry about so insufficient and someone wants to try to make some money because they're struggling but that you'll never amount
[40:51]that that will never amount that some of you trying to do something you know go fishing line out there taking coefficient on out there's if they can catch something and that's alright and I
[41:02]understand why they're doing it and I understand what they're trying to do
[41:08]doesn't make it right but there is really no fishings all that's going on and I
[41:21]wouldn't worry about let's break this down Julie I want to start with you we have this petition from this group of
[41:31]friends of dan mark Cal asking the state attorney to arrest the a Tellson's given what we've just heard and there's a more out there as well if you want to follow the trial you can always go back to long
[41:41]crime and watch our trials over again the this petition is the state attorney listening to this could it really work could the Adel sins ultimately be
[41:51]charged here so you know it's a tough time I think many people are concerned because it's been so long and friends of his are concerned obviously with Kovac that things are gonna kind of fall to
[42:02]the wayside the problem many times with these murder-for-hire cases is the strongest cases against the actual shooter or stabber the person who actually commits the crime and the
[42:13]person that hires them the person that puts them up to it is often the one most protected that's why they do these murder for hire because they don't want to be the one who's actually with the
[42:23]dirty fingers you know they want to have clean hands and so in this case you have to prove not just that they knew about it not just that they might have been involved but that one or all of those
[42:34]individuals were in fact responsible and had the intent to kill this individual and prove it beyond a reasonable doubt and that may be one of the sticking points but the prosecutor is proving if
[42:45]they knew and being it would prove which one of them which one of the Olsons is that all of them is that the father is that the mother is the brother which one let's stick with Charlie for a second
[42:57]dr. Liang let me turn to you there seems to be a disagreement or there was a disagreement between what the police wanted to happen and what the state's
[43:07]top prosecutor the the community's top prosecutor wanted to happen my understanding is the former state attorney of that jurisdiction said there wasn't enough probable probable cause to
[43:17]arrest Charlie Adelson even though the police filed it probable cause or had a probable cause document saying that he should be arrested what's that disconnect there how is that possible
[43:27]it so that this Kinect comes because when we're working with the prosecutors the prosecutors are looking at the end of of this trial and that is do they have evidence beyond a reasonable doubt
[43:39]and sometimes we as investigators like to use the probable cause to further the investigation it's important to get the
[43:49]person into the box early into the investigation so having probable cause make it an arrest and getting them into an interview or interrogation and beginning to establish timelines and
[43:59]whatnot in is really important for us and helps to actually build the case more towards that beyond a reasonable doubt that the prosecutors looking for
[44:09]and remember that former state attorney Willie Meg's believed that there was enough problem because the current state attorney Jack Campbell said this is still ongoing he even said that in
[44:19]response to what will happen to the Adel scens as with everything we'll say we'll watch what happens and we're gonna wait for the retrial of Catherine mag bana wah I want to thank all my guests tonight
[44:30]julie terry dr. lang thank you so much for your perspective everyone out there we will be back in the meantime stay
[44:38]safe we'll see you next time [Music]