[0:14]I'm Vinnie palitan the subject of my investigation The NeverEnding controversy surrounding Jeffrey Epstein it's the story that no one seems to want
[0:23]to tell how powerful were the people he was connected to and have they suppressed the truth truth when will the
[0:31]public learn the whole truth here's the story Jeffrey Epstein was a financier and convicted sex offender who owned
[0:42]little St James a private island in the US Virgin Islands which he purchased in 1998 the island often referred to as pedophile Island was allegedly a site
[0:53]where Epstein orchestrated illicit activities involving miners in 2008 Epstein faced charges for soliciting a minor for prostitution he secured a
[1:03]controversial plea deal with Federal prosecutors pleading guilty to lesser State charges this agreement granted him a 13-month sentence with work relase
[1:14]Privileges and Immunity from federal prosecution for himself and potential co-conspirators why would prosecutors
[1:23]ever give immunity to potential co-conspirators who was Epstein protecting that was was and continues to be the big question surrounding the
[1:33]Epstein case in 2019 he was arrested again on federal charges of sex trafficking Miners and all that reignited discussions about this previous plea deal and the extent of his
[1:44]influential connections then before any deal or trial Could Happen Epstein was found dead in his jail cell but his
[1:54]death has not stopped the public Pursuit for information about any other powerful people connected to Epstein this is one of those cases one
[2:07]of those stories one of those investigations where we always feel like there is more to this that we're not getting the whole story that we're not
[2:17]getting the whole truth and obviously there have been criminal prosecutions there's Discovery there's documents um there's all types of material but how much of that has
[2:28]been made public well we've got a new administration at the Department of Justice and recently uh some things were released um including the Epstein
[2:40]contact list which redacts all of the contact information but has a list of names people like Mike Bloomberg John
[2:50]CLE from Monty Python um Mick Jagger George Hamilton the man with the Perpetual Tan Andrew
[2:59]Cuomo Courtney Love um Ivanka and Ivana Trump and and Donald Barbara Walters like it's a it's a mishmash of people
[3:09]and obviously he's you know rubbing elbows with the rich and the famous but these are all part of the contact list that's been released there was also a
[3:18]masseuse list that was released but it was heavily redacted and again the redactions are what we've been told is
[3:30]to protect the identities and information connected to victims so where are we in all this there is more information uh that the
[3:41]Department of Justice and the FBI has and that brings us to the first question in our investigation what hasn't been
[3:55]released this is the question that's been ongoing for the longest time like we had a a trial we had documents sealed then unsealed and then not released and
[4:05]redacted joining us to help try to get to the bottom of all this reporter Kate hussy with scripts News Group in West Palm Beach Florida and former Federal
[4:17]prosecutor and president of the West Coast trial lawyers Neema ramani okay Kate what do we have an idea of what has
[4:27]not been released yeah Vinnie good evening according to us attorney Pam Bondi thousands of documents from the FBI's New York office
[4:37]haven't been released she says that she's received a truckload of those after she released about 200 Pages you of course mentioned the Muse list the
[4:46]contact book pages and flight logs as well she's saying there's thousands of other documents that exist out there that we have never laid eyes on and
[4:57]we've spoken to our sources down here in PM Beach County that worked really closely with with this case when it was first being prosecuted the former State Attorney over this Palm Beach County
[5:07]District we've spoken to an FBI agent former FBI agent very close to this case who do say that when the FBI raided Epstein's home in 2019 they also found a
[5:18]thumb drive in a safe and prosecutors in our area have said that that information whatever is on that thumb drive also hasn't been released part of that as you
[5:29]mentioned could be to protect the Identity or identities of victims that you know could their identities could be revealed on that on that thumb drive but
[5:39]the criticism here is I think from Pam Boni we heard that she did receive those thousands of documents but has never said when we might get to lay eyes on
[5:49]those NE herani why why are we here in 2025 and and this is still an issue a a case like this that was you know surrounded in controver rovery from the
[6:00]beginning going back all the way to 2008 everyone was smelling that something wasn't right why has it taken so long for the government to provide the federal government which he used to work
[6:11]for uh to provide some transparency here well it started with what you said Vinnie Alex aosta when he was us attorney in the southern district of
[6:21]Florida gave Jeff Epstein an unprecedented sweetheart deal unconscionable and you know obviously my former laer Professor Alan dtz was instrumental in securing that deal but
[6:33]he shouldn't have received that and then obviously because of some very good reporting by folks in Florida they exposed Jeffrey Epstein for the Predator that he is and the civil lawsuits
[6:44]followed and some of the issues were the judges in the case took a very broad view of redacting and cealing which you know that I do not like everything that's filed unless of course needs to
[6:55]protect a victim or there's some other legitimate privacy reason should be public and then you have gilain Maxwell after Jeff Epstein kills himself she
[7:05]pushes her case to trial and she really doesn't say anything and she really is the person who is the key to all the information now and I'm surprised she
[7:16]still hasn't cooperated now that she's lost her appeals and she's going to spend essentially the rest of her life in federal prison but part of the problem Vinnie is people that are
[7:26]watching think that there is a client list we've talked about the flight logs we talked about the contact list this was already made public in different
[7:37]lawsuits there's nothing new in attorney general bondi's phase one binders it was one of the most overhyped but
[7:47]underwhelming reveals I've ever seen and people on both sides were upset a lot of conservatives that think that you know different administrations Democratic administrations have covered up for
[7:57]Jeffrey Epstein to protect themselves but when Donald Trump ran he promised to make all this information public and it hasn't been made public so Bondi had a lot of egg on her face she blamed the
[8:08]FBI director Patel the New York was was it part of the problem that New York did not provide all the information until she demanded it in through a letter and then after the letter was written then
[8:20]all of a sudden thousands and thousands of documents show up so um Kate let me ask you there's there's no timetable that's been made public has there been
[8:31]an acknowledgement that the reason there's no timetable uh is the explanation the the redactions the the information that can't be made public or they don't want to make public uh
[8:41]relative to uh victims yeah Vinnie bondy has acknowledged that it may take some time to go through these documents sort through them and and really see what they are and of course like you
[8:51]mentioned redact them if need be she's also cited potential national security reasons as to why these documents might need to be redacted in addition to protecting the identities of potential
[9:03]victims here um she's been questioned a little bit on why there would be a national security concern here but of course again we don't know what these documents contain we don't know if there
[9:13]are additional Court depositions we don't know if there are interviews with Witnesses we don't know even who's going to be named if anyone that we don't already know about in these new
[9:23]documents so some of the things like the names that that came out we we saw those before you know prominent names including Michael
[9:32]Jackson uh stepen Hawking U we knew about Donald Trump we knew about Bill Clinton but another one that jumped out of me Louis free who was the head of the FBI all these things make people very
[9:42]suspicious when names like this pop up now the items found at Epstein's US Virgin Islands home a photo album of a girl and Epstein a bag containing one
[9:52]set of copper handcuffs and a whip okay this is the one for me dozens of computers record devices and hard drives Nema do you think that's what the
[10:03]thousands of documents could be relative to here the what was on the computers what's on the recording devices what's on the hard drives what's on the thumb drive I mean is that where all the
[10:13]information is that for some reason or another has never been made public I don't think so because if it was any pertinent relevant information it would have been brought out in the
[10:24]Gan Maxwell criminal trial right so I think that the information doesn't exist I don't think there is a Client List otherwise it would have come
[10:34]this is Al Capone's uh tomb here that we're talking about I think unfortunately it's going to be a dead end and again reading between the lines it sounds like we're talking about pages and we're not
[10:45]talking about electronic files so any information this is an older case there's been civil lawsuits there's been litigation it would have come out by now you and prince Andrew almost went to
[10:56]trial against Virginia Jew free there were tons of depositions taken believe me I want to know what is on those computers more than anyone but people
[11:08]that are watching and expecting there to be some sort of bombshell related to Jeff Epstein I think they're going to be very disappointed and frankly I think Bonnie did a poor job announcing this
[11:19]reveal if she hadn't reviewed or had someone review all this evidence beforehand so Kate what what what are folks saying on the ground down there in Florida are they expect
[11:30]ing something that we don't know are they expecting something that will reveal names powerful people influential people
[11:41]directly connected to what was happening to those young women and girls you know Vinnie I think there's an expectation that there should be the release of more evidence but also a fear
[11:53]that there isn't going to be anything new revealed in these documents because I think that first release of about 20 pages that really was nothing new it provided us no additional context
[12:03]nothing that hadn't already been released in court depositions and civil litigation it was a big let down for people and so I think we're feeling a distrust from our community from those
[12:14]that worked on the case from former prosecutors in this area a fear and a distrust that when if we get another release of documents that it isn't going to make a difference there are though
[12:26]many that do hope that isn't the case we've interviewed the mothers and the family members of some of the victims in this case and many of them feel like there hasn't been enough accountability
[12:36]here they are calling for not only the release but also the prosecution of other names that could have been associated with Jeffrey Epstein but you know Vinnie as you well know the struggle here is that everything we've
[12:47]received so far while it contains hundreds of names it doesn't imply any sort of guilt or any participation in the doings of Jeffrey Epstein I mean we
[12:58]take a look at that light log and nothing indicates that any of those people even went to Jeffrey Epstein's Island for example we see Donald Trump named in those documents but all we
[13:10]really see is him flying say to DC with Jeffrey Epstein that isn't any admission of guilt it's no implication of wrongdoing and goes for those pages of his contact
[13:21]book Kate hussy Nea Romani thank you so much the story continues coming up next and Nema brought this up why didn't gilain Maxwell give up the
[13:32]information Maxwell and Epstein had a method typically they would befriend these young girls by asking them questions about their lives pretending
[13:43]to be taking an interest in them 10:15 a dog has heard barking this is the first case you'll ever hear that you got to determine the time of death
[13:54]by a dog's whale there were no ring cameras there were no cell phones to Ping off locations was that white Bronco there at the time you drove by I didn't see it there was one critical witness
[14:04]that was never called she saw OJ's white Bronco trial and error why did OJ win a court TV original series new episode
[14:14]Sunday night 8 Eastern and Pacific only on court TV Maxwell was among ep's closest
[14:25]Associates and helped him exploit girls who were as as young as 14 years old Maxwell played a critical role in
[14:36]helping Epstein to identify a friend and groom minor victims for abuse in some cases Maxwell participated in the abuse
[14:47]herself all right that's back in 2020 now after Epstein loses his life in in custody then all of a sudden the focus is put on gilain Maxwell let's take a
[14:59]listen uh to that us attorney that's Audrey Strauss uh prosecutor talking about gilain Maxwell and her role in all of
[15:09]this starting in 1994 until at least 1997 Maxwell had a
[15:23]personal and professional relationship with Jeffrey she pretended to be a woman they could trust all the while she was setting them
[15:34]up to be sexually abused by Epstein and in some cases by Maxwell herself okay so I want you to take a
[15:46]look at some of the images of gilain Maxwell rubbing Jeffrey Epstein's feet and I want you to see this to so you understand the nature of this
[15:57]relationship How Bizarre far and strange it actually is it's one thing to like have your feet rubbed on the private plane but it's another to do it like
[16:07]that and then memorialize it with pictures these people are bizarre they are freaky right but they're kind of In
[16:18]It Together only one was alive though to go to trial which brings us to the next question in my investigation
[16:29][Applause] why didn't gilain Maxwell give up the information like if she the only card she had to play she was in federal court
[16:40]they had great evidence in the case facing you know 20 years in prison if you got a card to play aren't you going to play it and isn't that card going
[16:51]after some big fish so why didn't she let's get to the bottom of it joining me investigative reporter and author of the book The
[17:01]Spider inside the criminal web of Jeffrey Epstein and gain Maxwell Barry LaVine is with us and here in studio criminal defense attorney Josh Schiffer
[17:11]all right Barry do you have a theory on why she wouldn't give up the information if she had it right like who else was involved in all
[17:22]this you know gain uh the question is is gain going to take what she knows to her grave just like Jeffrey took what he
[17:33]knew and participation to his grave thus far she has not given up anything and as far as we know there had never been a a
[17:43]deal offered at the outset of this thing um you have to understand her mindset she's an extremely stubborn individual who
[17:54]believes that she has done nothing wrong now we know from interviews interviews I conducted for my book the investigation
[18:04]interviews with others that she regarded these girls these underage girls as I
[18:12]can I can say a quote as uh as trash she didn't think anything of these girls uh however she was instrumental particularly from the period of time of
[18:23]1994 to 2004 in which her trial rested in um gaining these women soliciting them bringing them aboard and also grooming
[18:34]them uh for Jeffrey as I said in my book they were the Predator version of Bonnie and Clyde they really worked together um
[18:45]as she you know rots away in jail down in Tallahassee Florida the question is is she ever going to get to the point where she's going to want to make it some type of a
[18:54]deal and uh thus far she is still refus using to admit any wrongdoing in this case I want to take a listen to Damen Williams the former US attorney after
[19:05]the conviction of gilain Maxwell a unanimous Jury has found Galen Maxwell guilty of one of the worst crimes imaginable facilitating and
[19:17]participating in the sexual abuse of children crimes that she committed with her longtime partner and co-conspirator Jeffrey
[19:27]Epstein the road road to justice has been far too long 20 years Josh Schiffer that's a lot of time for someone who was living the
[19:38]life that she had lived up until the point of going to prison why didn't she give up the information it's the only card to play isn't it yeah but what is that card worth and you've got to look
[19:50]at the risk reward analysis as well is the utility of whatever she's going to share what's the risk oh risk what
[19:59]happens to from all of these apparently notable individuals what kind of power do they have the levers behind the scenes if you want to get into the scary conspiracy theory some of these people
[20:10]can have people rubbed out just by snapping their fingers and there's still allegations that Mr Epstein was murdered or something like that so there really
[20:20]wasn't a lot of value for her during the trial to come out and name some of the names because it wasn't going to exonerate her she wasn't going to get a
[20:30]gift or a get from the US attorney for ratting out some super famous celebrity much better for her to hold back see if those names increase in value during her
[20:42]sentence you know bar to me I I I look at it and I'm like it's the only potential chance and it's something you could approach the US attorney with or
[20:53]approached the Department of Justice is there any sense that they weren't interested in that no no no uh listen they they were
[21:03]obviously hoping that her and her lawyers would offer up something in terms of uh Prosecuting um some of
[21:12]Jeffrey Epstein's very powerful friends uh she knows where the bodies are buried from the period of time from 1994 to
[21:21]2004 that was her association with him he continued on his own in terms of the recruitment of young girls up until he
[21:30]was uh finally arrested in New York uh however during that first 10year period uh you know there were associations with
[21:41]with many many powerful individuals and she certainly knows you know so much but again she's an individual who has
[21:50]refused to acknowledge any wrongdoing uh she's always operated under you know an air of hisory right
[22:00]before she went on the lamb um she showed off a book related to the CIA and a photograph after Jeffrey Epstein's
[22:09]death her father Robert Maxwell uh the Fleet Street publisher was said to be um
[22:16]an operative of U uh the Israeli uh government uh so she brings in a lot of um
[22:25]Espionage and uh possible very layered all right uh Barry's going to stay with us Josh is staying with us up next how
[22:34]many victims are there I'm VI palitan we continue our
[22:55]investigation of the life and death of Jeffrey Epstein who since he died has become an even more intriguing figure how powerful was he and the people that
[23:05]he spent time with and who were the victims of his abuse here's the story Jeffrey Epstein was a finance year
[23:15]and convicted sex offender who trafficked miners his 2019 arrest his controversial connections and his mysterious death continued to spark
[23:25]public scrutiny Epstein's victims have pursued Justice through various legal Avenues resulting in both civil settlements and criminal investigations
[23:35]in 2008 Epstein faced a lawsuit from a Virginia woman alleging sexual assault when she was 16 similar suits followed many resulting in out of court
[23:45]settlements in 2019 Maria farmer filed an affidavit accusing Epstein and gilain Maxwell of assaulting her and her 15-year-old sister in
[23:54]1996 Virginia jra's 2009 lawsuit accused used Epstein and Maxwell of sexual trafficking when she was a minor it was settled for
[24:04]$500,000 in November of 20202 Epstein's victims filed lawsuits against Deutsche Bank and JP Morgan Chase alleging the bank's complicity in his Crimes by May
[24:15]of 2023 Deutsche Bank agreed to a $75 million settlement and JP Morgan Chase settled for 290 million these cases
[24:25]answered some questions but many more questions have been left unanswered the discussion is always about Jeffrey Epstein but the reason you
[24:35]discuss Jeffrey Epstein is because of the victims the victims who suffered at the hands of Jeffrey Epstein and gain Maxwell I want you to take a a look here
[24:45]Glory all red with one of those victims he put me in a vulnerable independent situation and took advantage
[24:54]of me I was only 17 years old I was a little girl so throughout all of this you know
[25:05]there's the the the Curiosity and wondering who else is involved who are all these powerful people and then how
[25:12]large was this this Enterprise how far did it go that brings us to the next question in our
[25:23]investigation and it's about the victims how many VI victims are there in this case joining me investigative reporter and author of the book The
[25:34]Spider inside the Criminal Mind of Jeffrey Epstein and gilain Maxwell Barry LaVine is with us and in studio criminal
[25:44]defense attorney Josh Schiffer okay so give us an idea Barry how how you know the old question how
[25:55]big is it like how many victims are we talking about about here potentially well we know that more than 200 victims applied to the compensate
[26:05]victims compensation fund that you know there was really hard work done by Denise George who was the district attorney down the Virgin Islands wherein had his home and she really forced the
[26:17]executives of his estate to set up a um um victims compensation fund more than 200 women applied to that and the um f
[26:27]EP the state paid out more than $150 million we also know of course based on Denise's work that uh the two Banks JP
[26:37]Morgan and D A Bank also set up compensation funds and had to pay out um over $300 million so more than
[26:46]250 uh women have have applied and and received um uh compensation but I estimate that there's probably a couple
[26:56]hundred other women who are victims who are you know o over Eastern Europe and in other locations who we may never know the identities of these uh of these
[27:06]individuals and exactly what happened to them you have to understand that after Jeffrey Epstein's slap on the wrist conviction down in Florida he set up a
[27:16]different type of operation for himself he had modeling fixers in um in Europe in France and and elsewhere fairy um
[27:27]young women over over to his island in the Virgin Islands where he was kind of out of sight of um uh investigators in
[27:37]in in the uh New York and Florida so a lot of abuse took place in the years after that conviction and these women
[27:46]were um brought in by plane and and sent back and I estimate that probably at least 200 more uh women took part in kind of the second phase of Jeffrey
[27:57]Epstein's sick uh sex trafficking unbelievable I want to take a listen to Elizabeth Stein one of the victims just to give you a better idea of what these
[28:07]young women were going through I met her as I said in the course of my employment and the first
[28:18]day that I met her um I offered to bring her packages to to drop them off to her it's something I frequently did for my high-end clients and I called and
[28:29]arranged for the delivery of the packages I was instructed to go to a hotel and that was close by to the store in Midtown Manhattan and when I arrived at the
[28:40]concierge I let them know I was dropping her packages and they let me know that she was in the bar area and she wanted me to meet someone the person she wanted me to meet
[28:51]was ultimately Jeffrey Epstein and that night in the hotel was the first time they assaulted me um my involvement with them lasted
[29:01]several years um I would try and get out of their View and try and get away from them but every time I did they found me
[29:12]and it became so desperate that I started changing jobs I changed Apartments cities states and even after
[29:23]all that they found me and years of running like that were really hard um and I started to crack
[29:33]and I ultimately was hospitalized for a nervous breakdown it's it's life altering I mean it it's difficult for a lot of these young women I would say probably most of
[29:45]them to recover from all this Josh shiffer what are your thoughts about how many people were talking how widespread was this network that he created uh just
[29:56]to give a little bit of context my my firm was involved in this and we represented a victim and we were there in court as all of this unfolded
[30:07]especially how we got to that victim's compensation fund which served a very useful purpose which is providing anonymity and that was something
[30:17]incredibly valuable not just to the few women that were brave enough to come out and be public but the literally hundreds of women that came forward through the process
[30:28]and as we were just talking about there are hundreds of women that I believe were involved that never came forward due to fear due to self-involvement due
[30:38]to the anxiety due to wondering what level of victimization they may or may not had not every one of these women was trafficked down to the Virgin Islands or New York City these women were
[30:50]victimized at a variety of different levels throughout this criminal conspiracy let me ask you Barry cuz and this kind of ties into another one of
[30:59]our questions tonight with all these victims it would seem that potentially some of them might have
[31:07]information about other predators and has any of that ever come through have any of them ever talked about that and has that been pursued in any way in
[31:19]terms of an investigation well we we know um Virginia Roberts jefra Who was the the
[31:28]primary accuser um gave a list of um more than a half a dozen men that she said she was trafficed to through
[31:37]Epstein um all of them have denied involvement um the prosecutors when they went after gilain steered clear of her
[31:47]accusations and they focused on uh four victims uh that testified against Maxwell a trial and I have to report sadly that one of those uh victims who
[31:58]testified against her in fact um died about a little bit more than a year ago of an accidental drug overdose despite all the compensation
[32:09]that did come through which was fantastic to help these women attempt to recover their lives those scars that they suffered in terms of the mental
[32:20]anguish from years ago still live still very real and still living with many of many of these women and and for some of them uh they've turned to uh drugs they
[32:31]they've sadly have turned to alcohol anything to to numb the uh horrific abuse that they that they suffered and as I said one of them uh who had
[32:42]testified against Maxwell uh sadly passed away so uh we have to constantly cons you know think and consider what these women went through and it's just
[32:53]it's unbelievable when you read uh the court files and some of the police reports of the horrific uh abuse that took place Josh I know you wanted to
[33:03]jump in there yeah and let me rip this bandage off here as well and talking about how these women recovered a victim's compensation fund was formed
[33:14]and it had many promises one of the big concerns was how much are these women going to realize and unfortunately at the conclusion of the victim's
[33:24]compensation fund payout the Jeffrey Epstein estate was left with hundreds hundreds of millions of dollars of assets and the plth Universe goes nuts because just with a couple of Trials
[33:35]those victims should have bankrupted Jeffrey Epstein's estate and it's an absolute betrayal of the justice system that his estate is still packed with money and it's money now that other
[33:47]entities are going after the victim's compensation fund was a failure because it didn't give Justice to these actual victims all right guests are staying
[33:57]with us still to come did Epstein really take his own life Epstein was found hanged in his lock cell within the prison's secure
[34:07]special housing unit the New York City's Office of the chief medical examiner determined that Epstein died by Suicide grieving widow or Mastermind
[34:18]behind a murder Monica Sean Tilly is accused of plotting to kill her husband famed celebrity hair stylist Fabio citelli prosecutors say she and her lover killed fabiio to collect a big
[34:29]life insurance policy the defense may say she's a bad woman but she wouldn't be involved in a murder it's a who done it Hollywood Story but will there be a Twist that no one sees the celebrity
[34:41]stylist murder trial We Day mornings only on court TV arguably one of the most notorious
[34:50]inmates in the bop's custody was left unmonitored and alone in his cell with an excess the prison lands thereby providing him with the opportunity to
[35:01]take his own life the death of Jeffrey Epstein is also part of the story and the skepticism of the public like we're not
[35:12]getting the whole story that's Michael harwitz Inspector General from the Department of Justice I want you to take a look at him explaining what happened
[35:22]to Jeffrey Epstein uh from his perspective you know after investigating his death on August 10 2019 Epstein was
[35:33]found hanged in his lock cell within the prison's secure special housing unit the New York City's Office of the chief medical examiner determined that Epstein died by Suicide we determined that MCC
[35:44]New York staff failed to ensure Epstein was assigned a cellmate as instructed by MCC New York psychology department following an incident on July 23rd where
[35:55]Epstein was found unresponsive in in a cell with a cloth wrapped around his neck in addition we concluded that MCC New York staff failed to undertake
[36:05]required measures designed to ensure Epstein and other inmates were accounted for and safen their cells such as inmate
[36:14]counts and rounds and searches of cells had Epstein cell been searched as required it would have revealed that Epstein had excess prison blankets
[36:25]Linens and clothing in his cell MCC New York staff also failed to ensure that the institution's security camera system was fully functional resulting in
[36:35]limited recorded video evidence while we determined MCC New York staff engaged in significant misconduct we didn't uncover evidence contradicting the FBI's determination
[36:47]that there was no criminality in connection with how Epstein died okay brings us to the next question in our investigation
[36:58]and this is a big one this is a big one go on the internet folks there's a lot of folks talking about it still talking about it did Epstein really take his own
[37:09]life there's different ways to look at um what the Inspector General said you know all this misconduct well why was this misconduct was it simple negligence
[37:20]was it purposeful what's going on here still with me investigative reporter Barry LaVine and in studio criminal defense attorney Josh shiffer Josh I'll begin with you on this one um so the
[37:31]cameras aren't working they're not searching not is this just bad work by the folks on the inside is it
[37:39]purposefully not done how and how can the public be convinced of what really happened here I I really want to believe
[37:50]in the conspiracy theories I really want to believe that there is an explanation this is why he killed himself someone help helped him kill himself someone may have been involved in murdering him but
[38:01]I also know having spent 25 years going in and out of big institutions like this uh the shoe yeah it's higher security
[38:10]but failed inspections every day watches that weren't made every day instructions not followed every single day there are
[38:21]immunities from suing these facilities that basically if you call attention to these problems chronic problems nothing gets done it's why so many jails and
[38:32]prisons in America are under regular routine monitoring from the Department of Justice from civil rights organizations because these kind of problems exist in every facility so if
[38:43]you're going to base the conspiracy that he didn't kill himself on the failures of underpaid H uh guards of a poorly
[38:55]runed Miss and that just that dog don't hunt uh it's absolutely possible uh but I haven't seen anything that concludes it one way or another Barry LaVine your
[39:05]thoughts about the death of Jeffrey Epstein yeah you have to understand this was a Man Who Loved controlling things the temperature had to be set at a
[39:16]certain uh degree in his uh different Estates certain amount of tows for all of his massages he was very exact and very specific with his staff everything
[39:27]was taken away from him in that jail cell he couldn't get the right medication he was eating his meals on the floor he knew that he wasn't going to get the slap on the wrist this time
[39:37]that he had down in Florida that he likely was going to be convicted and that he would face uh uh possible
[39:45]violence uh you know during a uh a jail sentence I really think he he decided to take his life that was the last bit of
[39:54]control uh that he had he also uh very damaging documents to the CA in the case came out two days before he changed his
[40:04]will uh he was going through a situation where um his cellmate had been uh uh moved out and another one was going to come in that next day he had really one
[40:15]night to do it and I do believe that he took advantage of that and decided that he was going to go out on his own terms and take his life because that was the last bit of control uh that he had in
[40:26]his life Barry how where did he get all his money from Jeffrey um made a lot of money
[40:35]through um Financial consultation with uh with with billionaires he also as I reported in my book uh he was into arms
[40:45]dealing for a period of time uh uh getting some money under the table in various ways uh he managed to skirt the law in terms of how he took advantage of
[40:56]his finan he was brilliant in terms of being a Financial Consultant and he operated just on the line of legality to
[41:05]U make um U you know to develop in state that at one point at the time of his death was worth $600 million wow and and
[41:15]why so many famous friends or associations did he have was it just the
[41:24]money Jeffrey was a a collector of people and certainly powerful people early early on in the show you talked about that contact list now a lot of
[41:35]those individuals never actually met Jeffrey Epstein but Jeffrey Epstein collected information about wealthy people from all different walks of life from from the science Community to the
[41:47]entertainment Community uh he was and the banking Community his relationships with uh former president uh Bill Clinton
[41:55]Prince Andrew uh Donald Trump early on in the uh in the 90s you have to understand that he wanted to connect these individuals with other individuals
[42:07]try to do favors for them and along the way he also attempted to Blackmail individuals uh as we know Bill Gates who there's no indication that Bill Gates ever took part in any specific
[42:19]wrongdoing but he admitted that Jeffrey Epstein attempted to blackmail him about a relationship he had uh with an individual so uh
[42:29]Jeffrey was always on the lookout for the ways to connect people and gain favors from the rich and Powerful Josh shff we have about 15 seconds here will
[42:40]the public ever be satisfied no absolutely not this is the most American story in the world and it hits every salacious detail because we know how filthy behind the counter or behind the
[42:52]curtain is we know that the richest people out there get away with everything in our current Community well if those documents that get released have any more information obviously
[43:04]we'll have you both back thanks so much Barry LaVine Josh shiffer you know the lack of trust in this case was born when prosecutors gave Epstein the deal of deals in 2008 Epstein then continued
[43:15]with his conduct seemingly protected by those who were supposed to protect the victims why was that that's the question that needs to be answered by the
[43:25]government through full transparency I'm Vinnie palitan we'll keep digging for answers as the
[43:35]investigation continues [Music]