[0:00]Tony, thanks so much for your time. So, let's maybe start at the beginning. When did you first know that Virginia would have anything to do with Prince Andrew?
[0:11]Uh she told me that she was going to meet him with Jeffrey. She did not expect to be having sex with him. It was just like, you know, meeting a famous person. Cuz as far as I knew, she wasn't scared to
[0:23]go there and then that all changed after she was there. Cuz I guess right after, you know, she found out exactly what they wanted her to do. What do you understand happened? What What has Virginia told you?
[0:35]Well, she actually called me when she was on the boat with them and told while she was there she told me that she called and she told me that she was scared because she knew what that
[0:46]Jeffrey wanted her to do, but she didn't want to do it and was asking me what I what I thought she would do or what she should do and
[0:56]you know, I explained to her, you know, whatever you can do to feel safe. I mean, to get out of the situation cuz there's obviously nothing I'll be able to do. I'm all the way in a different country.
[1:07]It was like a really rushed conversation. Think she just kind of snuck off and was you know, trying to just tell me what was going on. It wasn't like we had time to sit there
[1:18]and talk over it. Did she call you to talk to you specifically about Prince Andrew or was this to do with what Jeffrey Epstein expected her to do with with any man?
[1:30]No, it was with the prince with him and the prince. How did she sound on the phone to you? Uh she definitely sounded worried. Like if she didn't do what she was supposed to do, like something would
[1:39]happen. Did she indicate what that might be? No, she just told me she was scared and didn't know if she should do it, but then just said that, you know, it's kind of
[1:50]like they got so much money. It's like what What do you What happens if you say no? You know, they they could do whatever they want. >> Who did you believe the threat was coming from? Who was making her scared?
[2:01]I would imagine it would be Jeffrey because I mean, he was the one who basically was in control of it. When Virginia returned from the trip, what did she tell you about her encounter
[2:12]with Prince Andrew? I mean, when she came back she just started acting a lot different. Like a lot more distant. And [clears throat] um
[2:22]I don't know. You could just tell like she wasn't proud of what happened and we kind of really didn't talk about it. Like everything was so much different. How would you describe the toll that
[2:34]Virginia's work took on her? She used to be happy. Well, at least with me anyway. And then once it started to change, I don't know. It just you could just see like
[2:46]everything was like going in her eyes. You know, it's just like I don't know. There was never a point in our relationship before that, you know, it wasn't all about just me and her.
[2:57]And once it started to change like that, like I could just tell that it was all because of what was going on. The details that have come to light
[3:09]in in regards to Virginia's allegations against Prince Andrew that there were three encounters, were you aware of those details? I know
[3:19]that they met twice, but I didn't know about the last time. The first time I know they were on a boat and then I'm pretty sure it was an island or it was on the island. Um we've never heard of the boat before. I'm pretty sure
[3:30]positive that's where she called me from. It was like 20 years ago. But she called me while she was with them. So, it might have been at the island maybe then. There was definitely talk of a boat, I'm sure.
[3:42]It wasn't like she really gave me all the details, but she just I knew that it wasn't good. It was a long time ago and >> [clears throat]
[3:52]>> you could just tell the way she changed and after I knew we kind of had a like a mutual understanding like I really didn't want to know like specifics about
[4:03]stuff. You may not know Prince Andrew, but you do know Virginia. Is there any way that she could be making this up? No. I don't believe so at all.
[4:14]I highly doubt that. From the way she talked to me, I highly doubt that. Especially knowing Jeffrey and them. It's No. Were you aware of what was
[4:25]required of Virginia before meeting Prince Andrew? What she was required to do with Jeffrey Epstein? Uh yes, at some point like in our relationship she finally let me know
[4:37]what was going on. A lot of people they obviously started talking a lot of stuff about what they thought she was doing because nobody pays somebody money and
[4:48]travels them all around the world, you know, if they're just giving a massage. They could buy they could get a masseuse anywhere to do that. After so much of being tormented by my friends about it,
[5:00]you know, I talked to her about it and then [clears throat] she explained what you know, everything that was going on. What did she say? That she did more than massage and had to have sex with Jeffrey
[5:11]and find him other girls. Tell me about your relationship. You You were very young, right? You went to school together, is that right? >> When I first met her, I was a sophomore.
[5:22]And then she was like a year younger than me, so freshman. And then that's when we started when we met each other and then we started talking. And then she ended up staying with me for
[5:31]like a week or so and then her brother had ended up finding out where she was at and came and picked her up and then took her to rehab. And then I didn't [clears throat] see
[5:42]her again until after she was already working with Jeffrey. So, in those first meetings and when she came to stay with you, what sort of a a girl was Virginia? Well, when I was with her, I
[5:52]mean, we really I mean, we just had fun together, you know. When you did reconnect after she started with working with Jeffrey, uh tell me about your relationship at that
[6:04]stage. You moved in together? When I had met her again, I was hanging out with one of her her roommates, which was one of one of our friends we went to high school with. >> [clears throat] >> And it just so happened that obviously
[6:15]that he lived with her and he was just we were chilling around the pool. We were like, "Hey, let's go back to the apartment. We'll get some drinks or something." So, we go back and I saw pictures of her on the fridge and just
[6:26]around. And I'm like I was like, "You know Virginia?" And he's like, "That's Jenna. What do you mean? Who's Virginia?" I'm like, "Well, that's Virginia. I know for a
[6:36]fact." And we just started talking about it and he's like, "Oh yeah, well she lives here with her fiance. She works for this billionaire guy. So, she's like barely ever here." And he's like, "Oh, but she'll be here
[6:48]tomorrow if you want to come back tomorrow and see her." So, I came back tomorrow or the day after and as soon as she walked in the door, she dropped her bags, ran straight to me
[6:59]and it was like like it never ended. And then she ended up throwing away giving the dude back his ring. She made them all move out. I moved in
[7:10]and then went from there. Was she away a lot? Did you see a lot of her? Um I only saw her 2 weeks out of each month. Other than that, she was picked up or taken or
[7:21]I or I would take her over there and they would leave for the other 2 weeks. And how did you feel about that arrangement? I mean, honestly, at first I was fine with it. You know, I was 18. I had the
[7:32]place to myself 2 weeks out of the month. You know, she left me with money. I was chilling with my friends. I mean, I was loving it. Like as far as I knew, she was just a masseuse. When I found out, I mean, it was I mean, you
[7:44]could tell that she was upset about it like highly. When you are in that situation with somebody who has that much reach and can buy whatever they need or do
[7:55]whatever they want, get away with whatever they can get away with, it's like who's going to believe us anyway? You know, we dropped out of school, got kicked out of school. Was there an element of fear?
[8:06]Of course. When one person that powerful knows where you live, like where you sleep, when you see your girlfriend have to leave every 2 weeks and like when she gets that call, her face like
[8:17]completely switches from all right, I'm good to like, you know, it takes its toll and it gets pretty stressful. See, now a lot of criticism has been leveled at Virginia for being for taking part in
[8:28]a transactional arrangement. She's been painted as somebody who was a willing participant in this and and even worse, somebody who, you know, recruited girls.
[8:40]What's your view of that criticism? She was being used, being taken advantage of and regardless of what anybody thinks, I mean,
[8:50]she was underage. You know what I mean? The guy had no business period even doing anything and then when you give somebody all that much stuff and then like threaten them with
[9:00]other things, you know, it's it's kind of different, you know. What sort of threats were made? It was more so, "Okay, I got to be there like now." Like there was no
[9:12]arguing about it. There was no I don't even want to talk about it because it's not going to happen. It was just like, "I got to go." You know what I mean? Like it didn't matter. Whenever he was Whenever he called, it was like, "All
[9:23]right. Time to go." Did you feel that Virginia wanted to get out, could have gotten out if she wanted if she tried? Uh she did try to and he
[9:34]was he said the only way that she would be able to stop would be as if he kept getting her more girls. And even then that didn't He still didn't I mean, she still ended up having to go
[9:44]back. Did you ever meet Jeffrey Epstein or Ghislaine Maxwell? Yeah, I met them both. What was your impression? Well, when I was there, Jeffrey was cool to me. I mean, it
[9:56]Whenever I was in his house, like it never seemed like uh uh like he was just like a normal guy, you know? I mean, aside from having like pictures of naked chicks everywhere and stuff like that. But, I mean, he he just
[10:07]talked to me like a normal dude, asked me how I've been, what I've been up to, how's my job's going. Like, I'd only be there for like maybe like 15 minutes at a time, but like
[10:17]while I was there, he was I never you would have never assumed it. And then, when I met Ms. Maxwell, she was more more snobby, I should say, cuz it wasn't like I really really
[10:28]talked to her too much. It was more like I'd meet her and then she'd be like, "All right, I'm walking off." When you were in their presence, did you feel the power that they could wield? Just being
[10:37]in the house, just knowing you could just tell. I mean, the guy he had so much stuff. It's like when someone has that much money and the ability to do what they want, it makes
[10:49]the situation a lot harder. That house in Florida has been described as the house of horrors. What was your impression of the house when you were there? >> Um well, I never went through the whole
[11:01]house. I've never been upstairs. But, I mean, when I was there, sometimes there would just be random girls from all over the place around his house just
[11:10]walking around in bikinis. I would mainly talk to his chef hanging out while I was waiting for him to come out from wherever he was at. It was more like I think he more so brought me around
[11:22]kind of to like disprove if that makes sense to you. Like, so he can make it seem like there was nothing going on. Like, from two different sides. Like, she says one thing, but,
[11:34]you know, when I was there, it wasn't. Did it feel like there was something sinister going on? Well, that's the thing. Before I knew anything was going on, it just seemed like there
[11:44]was, you know, a guy paying for girls to hang out with him. Cuz, I mean, I mean, well, he's rich as hell, but I mean, he was, you know, gray-haired old older guy. And there was girls that were
[11:56]my age, you know? So, that's a big difference. Did you feel like your age or your youth, rather, was being used against you? I mean, was that part of the manipulation? I'm pretty sure it
[12:07]was. I don't even know how old he was back then. But, like, come on, man. You don't have no business hanging out with freaking high schoolers, you know?
[12:19]And it's like, back then, I didn't think anything of it, cuz like it seems like every man's dream. Like, when I would go over there, I'd go over, there'd be all sorts of freaking girls and stuff, and I was just like, you know, I was impressed. I was like,
[12:31]"Man." Then, once I found out what what was happening, like, those encounters when I was there started to make more sense. I mean, I get it. You got money, you know, girls
[12:42]will be around you. But, like, that's all I thought it was. I thought he was just having girls over. So. And they were from all over the world, so I didn't know
[12:53]I just thought he was doing the same thing with them that he was uh with Virginia. When Virginia told you that she was expected to meet a prince, what was your reaction? I I was pretty
[13:03]shocked. I didn't I to be honest, I was like, "Damn, really?" I didn't know that he was friends with all them over there. I mean, I knew he was connected to people, but I wasn't even I was like, "Man, that's, you know,
[13:15]that's a big deal." When you got that phone call from Virginia to say, "I'm now being told that I need to have sex with Prince Andrew." What did What sort of a world did you
[13:26]think she was in? Cuz obviously, if he's involved in it, then I was in my it just made my beliefs even stronger. Cuz I already thought he was
[13:36]into something. Cuz he like I said, you got that much money, you know that many people. You know, I I didn't think it was like royalty included in any of it any of this. And then, when I heard that, it was just
[13:47]like it's like, "Man, that's like how much bigger can you get than that, you know?" What led to you guys splitting up? Uh
[13:57]Jeffrey actually paid for her to go to Thailand. And then, when she was I dropped her off to the airport, and uh she just never came back. Did her work with Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine
[14:08]Maxwell affect your relationship in any way? For sure. I mean, I feel that if they if she would have never got on that plane or [ __ ] or even worked for them or
[14:19]whatever the [ __ ] case may be, I feel like we probably would have still been together, cuz I mean, she was like the first girl I
[14:27]ever loved. Like, wholeheartedly. So, to see somebody that you love being used in the way you've described by
[14:39]Jeffrey Epstein and and Ghislaine Maxwell and whoever else she was handed out to, what was that like for you? It was definitely not good, cuz like I
[14:49]said, after I learned about it, it was just like it was like a more like a feeling of helplessness, cuz it's like I don't want to leave, but like it just sucks, cuz I couldn't do
[15:02]anything. There's like nothing I could have done about any of it. I felt like, anyway. You know, like I said, it's I mean, 18-year-olds, I mean, what the heck does an
[15:12]18-year-old really know?