[0:06]Hello everyone, I'm Major Garrett in Washington. Welcome to this breaking news rolling coverage episode of The Takeout. Tonight, we are all shut down all the time because the longest and
[0:15]therefore costliest and most disruptive government shutdown in American history is coming to a close before our very eyes. We will have reporters, lawmakers, and political strategists with us the
[0:26]entire hour. All of this has a kind of fluid and improvisational feel because schedules can shift at a moment's notice and if they do, we will shift with those schedules. Right now, at this moment, we
[0:37]are tracking a key House procedural vote that will pave the way for final passage of the shutdown ending legislation. President Trump has promised to sign that legislation as soon as it makes its
[0:48]way from Capitol Hill to the Oval Office. Because this is government in action, the pictures lack a certain cinematic excitement and drama. But that is of little concern to federal
[0:59]employees and contractors eager, if not desperate, for the government to reopen so they can be paid. Ditto to those who receive supplemental nutrition benefits
[1:08]now suspended for lack of funding. Pop-up food banks and long lines at existing food banks, one of the many self-inflicted wounds of this bout of
[1:18]government paralysis. And the airlines, they are at this very hour awaiting permission from the transportation department to begin rebuilding schedules
[1:28]and also permission not to cancel any more flights. Yesterday and today, air traffic controller attendance picked up and that's a good sign. Our senior transportation correspondent Chris Van
[1:39]Cleave tells us airlines will need at least 24 to 48 hours to return to full flight schedules. And it's worth noting they are eager to do just that because
[1:49]canceled flights deprive them of revenue that can never be recouped. Not to mention the hassles they inflict and have inflicted on those with places to
[1:57]go. All shutdowns waste money, millions upon millions in the form of lost revenue, late fees, and extra administrative efforts to get things back up and running and deal with
[2:09]assignment backlog. separately. The Congressional Budget Office says this shutdown sucked at least 11 billion out of the US economy. We begin where else?
[2:19]With Nicole Killian paying very close attention to the House of Representatives. Nicole, there's been a lot of things going on on the Hill today and I know you're going to outline what's going to go on tonight, but first I want to play for you some sound and
[2:30]for our audience an exclusive interview our colleague John Dickerson did with the House Democratic leader Hakee Jeff. Let's listen. >> What do you hear from your constituents about those eight senators.
[2:42]>> Well, I haven't heard actually from our constituents about those eight senators, but what I have heard is keep up the fight, protect the health care of the American people, address this crisis,
[2:53]and America's too expensive, and we can't afford basic necessities and housing costs are too high, grocery costs are too high, utility bills and electricity bills are through the roof,
[3:04]and health care costs are way too high. We need you to do something about it. Well, one of the things we hear is, "We wanted you to fight. You were fighting and then you gave up in the end." >> Well, House Democrats are in this fight
[3:16]until we win this fight. This fight is not over for us. We're just getting started. >> What does that mean, though, for somebody who doesn't know the ins and outs of the House? How are you just getting started when the big fight that
[3:26]was teed up and the Democrats seem to be unified on then they weren't unified and now it's over? >> Well, Democrats remain strongly opposed to this Republican spending bill that continues to gut the healthcare of the
[3:36]American people. The Affordable Care Act tax credits expire on December 31st. We're in open enrollment right now. And Republicans in the House and some in the Senate have all said this is an issue
[3:48]that needs to be addressed. Democrats today have introduced legislation to extend the Affordable Care Act tax credits by 3 years. And we're going to force Republicans to vote on that. If
[3:59]not today, at some point soon. We have to >> Republicans claim that they want to extend the Affordable Care Act tax credits. they'll have an opportunity to do so since their leadership refuses to do that.
[4:10]>> Quick programming note, you can watch more of that interview with Hakee Jeff on the CBS Evening News tonight. Nicole, walk us through diagram the night for us ahead. >> Well, hopefully it will move relatively
[4:22]quickly. You know, we expect procedural votes to get underway in short order with that final vote occurring on this continuing resolution to keep the
[4:32]government funded through late January uh later this evening. The White House has already indicated that the president is at the ready ready to sign this bill
[4:43]as soon as it as it is passed. But it's worth noting that while Speaker Johnson remains confident that he has the votes to clear this message, it really will be
[4:53]on him to carry this vote because the Democratic leader has indicated that Democrats are strongly opposed to this measure precisely because it does not
[5:03]include any type of measure to deal with this healthc care issue, these expiring subsidies under the Affordable Care Act. So for that reason, most Democrats are
[5:14]expected to oppose this package. >> And uh very quickly, Nicole, the leader of the Democrats in the House, Hakee Jeff, told our John Dickerson that there's legislation. It's a discharge
[5:25]petition House Democrats have put forward today on this idea of extending the Obamacare tax credits. Explain to the audience what that means. >> Yeah, that's right. In fact, we also spoke with Leader Jeff about that
[5:36]discharge petition just before he filed it. And you know what he told me is that this is really an attempt to extend these affordable care act subsidies for
[5:48]the next 3 years to provide some certainty to those folks out there who are having to sign up for their insurance now facing these rising premiums. though to guarantee some additional certainty. And I asked the
[5:59]leader whether this means that he will not negotiate with Republicans on this issue if he's putting this discharge petition forward to try to force a vote, but he said, you know, we remain open to negotiating with Republicans. So, we
[6:10]will see if that comes to pass. We know there are certainly discussions expected to happen here in the Senate, but as you know, uh while Leader Thun has guaranteed a vote there, Speaker Johnson
[6:20]has not done the same in his chamber. So that's part of why leader Jeff is moving forward with that discharge petition. >> Nicole Killian on Capitol Hill. Thank you so very much. What you saw on split screen, ladies and gentlemen, continued
[6:32]debate on the House floor about the rule. California Democratic Congressman and vice chair of the House Democratic Caucus Ted Lou joins me now. Congressman, I appreciate your time as always. Just for my audience's benefit,
[6:43]I'm going to remind them these extended Obamacare tax credits first appeared in the American Rescue Plan in the early days of CO under the Biden administration. Under the Biden administration dealing with CO, not the
[6:53]early days of CO. Then they were added and extended upon in the inflation reduction act. But in both instances, Democrats in charge set an expiration
[7:03]date. You set this expiration date of December 31st this year. So, aren't you at least partially to blame for the fact that they're going to expire? >> Not at all. Under Donald Trump and
[7:16]Republicans, they've assaulted healthcare, making deep cuts not just to the Affordable Care Act, but also Medicaid and Medicare. Democrats are fighting for all of healthcare to make
[7:27]sure that health care insurance costs don't skyrocket for millions of Americans. And that is why we are staying strong. will be voting no in the House against this awful bill that's
[7:38]going to do nothing to stop health care costs from rising. >> And in that sense, Congressman, do you have any criticism for the Democratic leader in the Senate, Charles Schumer, or those Democrats who switched sides
[7:48]and voted to send this legislation to the House? >> Let me just put out a reminder that Republicans control the House, the Senate, and the White House. That means
[8:00]Republicans control what bills they bring up, the vote threshold for every bill. Donald Trump Republicans could have stopped this shutdown weeks ago.
[8:09]>> Instead, House Speaker Mike Johnson kept Republicans on vacation for six straight weeks. >> Do you expect the vote to pass tonight, Congressman? >> I know that House Democrats are going to
[8:23]stand strong and vote no. It would depend on how many House Republicans joined House Democrats because under the Trump administration, not only has inflation continued to increase and
[8:33]grocery prices increased, but healthc care costs have skyrocketed. And the American people know that. And Congressman, when you hear Republicans say, as they've begun to say in the last
[8:44]week or so, one of the problems with the extension or extending the Obamacare tax credits is that money goes straight to insurance companies. Insurance companies have profited from that. and that they
[8:55]are overly generous because they allow they allow people 400% above the poverty line to receive these extended Obamacare tax credits. There needs to be reforms to them. Do you want to keep them
[9:07]exactly as they are? Are you open to reform? That is just a dumb argument, right? So people who have employer based health care, the reason that employees can
[9:17]afford that because employers are paying a lot of that health care premium and that goes straight to insurance companies. So people on affordable care act, they don't have employers and employers can't pay that. So the
[9:29]government is essentially doing that part of it and yes, of course it goes to insurance companies. That's because health care is too expensive across the board. We have to lower health care costs. But in the meantime, we've got to
[9:40]make sure that people on affordable care act can get the health care because they have skyrocketing costs because of the Trump administration and what Republicans have done. >> Democrats on the House oversight
[9:51]committee released some emails and other transcripts and other documents related to Jeffrey Epstein. What do they tell you, if anything? >> The newly disclosed emails today are
[10:03]highly disturbing. They show that Donald Trump knew about Jeffrey Epstein's pedophilia ring and that Donald Trump spent hours with an underageed victim.
[10:13]More emails are being released. And today, the 218 signature on this charge petition was signed by Congresswoman Adelita Graova. So now it's going to force a floor vote on the House of
[10:24]Representatives to release epsene files. The Department of Justice better get their act together and release epsene files and stop this cover up. When the White House says, as it did today, Congressman, that these were released by
[10:36]Democrats to distract from the end of the government shutdown and prove nothing and that the president, when he knew Jeffrey Epstein kicked him out of Mara Lago and did nothing wrong, you say
[10:48]what? The White House has not contradicted any of these highly disturbing emails. And oh, by the way, Republicans also just
[10:58]released emails as well. And so Republicans are seeing the writing on the wall. They know this is a massive cover up of rape of young children. This
[11:09]should be a bipartisan issue and the Department of Justice needs to stop kissing the ass of Gain Maxwell and of covering up the Epstein files. >> Ted Lou, Democratic Congressman from
[11:20]California. Thank you. I appreciate the time. >> Thank you. Earlier, I spoke with Oklahoma Republican Congressman and importantly, House Appropriations Committee Chairman Tom Cole. Take a
[11:32]listen. Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the time. Lots to discuss, but first things first. Do you expect the legislation required to end the federal government
[11:40]shutdown to pass this evening? >> I believe it will. It'll be a close vote. I wish it were a little bit more bipartisan than I think it's likely to
[11:50]be, but pretty sure we've got the votes. got a good product and I think people are very tired of the shutdown. So, we feel good about our prospects.
[11:59]>> It sets a January 30th deadline for finishing the remaining spending bills. By my count, that's nine. That's a lot of work to do.
[12:11]>> It is. Uh and a couple of really big bills. defense, which is half of our total discretionary spending along with the so-called labor h labor health and human services and education bill, which
[12:22]is usually the favorite Democratic bill. So, we'll put those in a package with some other bills and uh you know, work in good faith with our negotiating
[12:31]partners on both sides of the aisle and both chambers and we're pretty good at getting this done. We've uh the the differences aren't as great as many people think. So, I think we've got a
[12:42]good shot of doing it as long as the too much bad blood didn't build up during this shutdown. >> One of the powers of being chairman is setting the schedule. So, set my
[12:54]schedule. What's it going to look like? >> Well, again, uh we would hope to get the next package done before the Christmas break. Uh but again that depends on the
[13:05]mood that our our colleagues on the other side of the aisle and in the other chamber are in. Uh the Senate has shown it can get work done. I'm very appreciative of uh the fact they got
[13:16]this bill out of there with three appropriations bills attached to it. So they've given us the time and the runway we need. We'll get a very good start tonight. Uh you take care of
[13:28]agriculture. you that takes care of WIC and SNAP for some of our most vulnerable citizens. Then obviously military construction and veterans.
[13:39]That's pretty important. Take care of our veterans. And then we'll pass the so-called ledge branch bill that actually lets Congress function, make sure that the capital police are paid,
[13:50]the staff up here that do all the work. So, I think if we can get those going, then that sets the right uh uh stage, so to speak, to move on to the more substantive bills.
[14:01]>> I know you can't guarantee this, Mr. Chairman, but lots of federal workers, contractors, those who receive SNAP benefits desperately want to know the answer to this. Will there be another
[14:10]shutdown at the end of January 20 26? >> I would hope not. Uh, look, I would hope we get all our work done by then. If we can't, then I would favor doing a
[14:22]continuing resolution for the anything that remains and going on. But the real thing would be to get the bills done. Uh give people some certainty. We've had a lot of people out there working without
[14:33]paychecks. Uh that's pretty tough on a family. They got a mortgage to pay. They got a car payment. They've got to get food on the table. And then obviously we've got very vulnerable people that
[14:42]are relying on Wick and SNAP uh that shouldn't have to worry about where their next meal is coming from. So, uh, I think getting those things taken care of tonight, uh, hopefully will create
[14:54]the kind of mood that we can work together because to for this thing to work, you've got to have bipartisan compromise on appropriations bill. Uh, fortunately, I've got counterparts or
[15:04]while we're probably we're going to differ on this tonight, I think when we go forward, they they'll be anxious to get things done as well. >> Mr. Mr. Chairman, do you expect a vote in December on any legislation in the
[15:16]House regarding extension of soon to expire Obamacare tax credits? >> I really don't know. That's not in the jurisdiction of our committee. I think a
[15:26]lot will depend on what happens in the Senate. Uh, as you know, uh, part of the agreement in the Senate was to guarantee a vote on that. Uh, you've got to get to
[15:36]60. There's only 47 Democrats, so that means to have any shot. They would have to have a serious negotiation with the Republicans. I don't think they would
[15:46]survive as they are now, but I think a deal is possible. But again, that'll start in the Senate and then we'll take a look at what they've done and see if something can be done over here. But
[15:56]again, that's well above my pay grade. Speaker will make the call about what comes up on the floor. And look, I'm pretty supportive of whatever Mike Johnson does. I think he's u pretty good
[16:06]at solving problems. >> Do you think, Mr. Mr. Chairman, those Obamacare tax credits should be extended as they are currently written. Yes or no?
[16:17]>> No, I don't. Uh they frankly uh you know they're asking for a trillion half dollars of guaranteed spending over 10 years in exchange for a few weeks of
[16:29]open government right now. Uh these things were meant to be, you know, a temporary measure. They were passed during COVID. Our friends on the other
[16:38]side didn't use any Republican votes to pass them or fashion them. They haven't offered any substantive ideas about reform. Uh I think as the majority leader in the Senate indicated, and I
[16:50]think the president as well, we're willing to talk and negotiate. We're not willing to accept the situation as it is. There are people making up to5 or $600,000 a year getting subsidies. I
[17:00]don't think anybody in America thinks that's very smart. If we can, again, the basic bill itself takes care of people uh that up to four times poverty level.
[17:11]So, the really needy are going to get the subsidies they need. Uh but let's look at some reforms. Right now, we're shipping out a lot of money to health care companies. Sometimes the beneficiaries don't even know they've
[17:23]got insurance. Uh so, actually, the president introduced a pretty interesting idea when he raised the sub. Why don't we just send the money to people and let them make the choice for themselves as to what they want to do?
[17:33]There's a lot of merit in that suggestion. >> Oklahoma Republican and for the context of this conversation, far more importantly, the chairman of the Appropriations Committee, Tom Cole. Mr. Cole, Mr. Cole and Mr. Chairman, thanks
[17:44]so much for your time. >> Major, thank you. >> Democrats on the House Oversight Committee have released email exchanges between Jeffrey Epstein and others about
[17:55]President Trump. Among the documents, this 2019 email from Jeffrey Epstein to author Michael Wolf that said, quote, "Trump knew about the girls and asked Gain to stop." That's a reference to
[18:05]Galileain Maxwell. Arua Jen joins us now from the White House. What else do they say or suggest, Ouija? And what is the White House saying about those suggestions or implications?
[18:16]Well, Major, Democrats are suggesting that President Trump knew much more than he has uh acknowledged to knowing about Jeffrey Epstein's sex trafficking
[18:26]operation and uh all of the heinous crimes that he was convicted uh for. And so, Democrats released these emails that
[18:37]were part of a 20,000 document trunch. And it was the Democrats who redacted some of those things. In another email that Epstein uh wrote to his longtime
[18:48]associate Galileain Maxwell back in 2011, um Epstein writes that Trump spent
[18:55]hours at his house with uh Virginia and that Virginia is Virginia Guay. The reason that matters first, the White
[19:06]House is the one that identified her and that is because in these documents that were released originally by the House Oversight Committee, there was not a
[19:15]redaction of that name. Um, and so Virginia Guay is a survivor of Epstein abuse who ultimately died by suicide
[19:26]earlier this year. And she has said in depositions that President Trump did nothing. She saw him do nothing. She saw him not participating and in fact said
[19:36]he was always just very friendly to her. So the White House is accusing Democrats of trying to cover up something that should never have been covered up because this is a person who has already
[19:47]publicly said Trump had nothing to do with Epstein's operations major. So, um, it is a bit complicated, but it's important context, uh, because that is
[19:58]what the White House is pointing to today to say the only thing that these emails show is that President Trump did nothing wrong. >> On the House floor, as the House
[20:08]continues to debate the rule that will procedurally press things forward on ending the government shutdown, some Democrats are mentioning these emails, calling for the Justice Department to release all of the available documents.
[20:20]Is there any indication at the White House that it is in favor of full Justice Department disclosure in this space? >> Uh well, previously during the campaign,
[20:31]uh now officials in the Trump administration, then supporters of candidate President Trump were very vocal about calling for the full release
[20:42]of all the Epstein files. And now the Department of Justice, of course, led by Attorney General Pam Bondi, says that they have already released everything that they legally can. And Democrats in
[20:53]Congress are calling their bluff on that. They are demanding that the Justice Department release even more. And just a few hours ago, um, there was an additional Democratic Congresswoman
[21:05]of Arizona, Rahala, who could be the last and final vote needed major to force a vote to see whether DOJ will actually release more of those documents.
[21:16]>> Ouija Jen at the White House, we should note that Adelita Graalva sworn in was the 218th signature to the discharge petition, which makes that now a live matter before the House of
[21:26]Representatives on a vote to release the Epstein files. you not the only vote that will be taken on that matter but an important hurdle crossed in the House of Representatives. Ouija Jang of the White
[21:37]House. Thanks so much. Reminding you we are in sort of rolling breaking news coverage about the end of the government shutdown which appears to be at least procedurally [music] within vision. House continues to debate the rule.
[21:48]After that there'll be a vote and then we'll move on. We will have all of the latest from Capitol Hill as well. I'm told maybe some analysis [music] and maybe some slices of pizza with that
[21:59]analysis. You're going to want to stay tuned for that. You're watching the takeout. My flight was supposed to be at 10:41
[22:13]and I am not going until 6:30 unless I get the standby tickets or no, they gave me a standby so I'm done. And they said, "What am I supposed to do?" She said, "Just stand there and beg to get on the
[22:25]plane. >> Beg to get on the flight." That's such comforting advice. Air travel for millions of Americans, like the woman you just heard from, impacted and that's putting it mildly by the longest
[22:35]government shutdown in US history. Staffing shortages leading to flight delays, cancellations, and the like. I want to bring in our political panel to discuss this and more. Joel Payne, CBS News political contributor and Democratic strategist. And Fred Upton,
[22:46]formerly served as Republican congressman representing Michigan, also once chairman of the Energy and Commerce Committee. And he brought pizza. The last time you were here, Fred, you said [clears throat] you were going to bring pizza. >> It looks like a pizza place. Well, it's from Detroit.
[22:58]>> Okay. It's Detroit style. It's Detroit style pizza. >> It is. And Jets Pizza is a Detroit franchise. >> Very good. Not a sponsor, at least not yet. >> Uh Joel, you heard Hakee Jeff talk to our colleague John Dickerson and say the
[23:10]fight isn't over. A lot of activist Democrats feel the fight is over and it's essentially a cave-in by the Democrats, at least in the Senate. >> It is a cave. And you know what's so
[23:20]problematic about this is you asked people in the activist community, your grassroots space, to to hang with you on this fight, to have your back, to show up on no kings, to make calls, to send
[23:32]emails, to vote on election day, >> and to somewhat pull the rug. I just look, I used to work at Senate Leadership. I totally get the legislative realities and the challenges
[23:43]that go along with this. You can't yo-yo your base that way. Um, and you cannot fall short of expectations of people who are expecting you to fight in a different way in the Donald Trump era.
[23:55]And I think there is a significant trust problem that still exists on a Democratic side. >> Fred, as you watch this play out, did you think Democrats were creating unrealistic expectations for that very base that Joel just described?
[24:05]>> I thought I thought they caved. I did. I mean, what did they get for it? I mean, oh, they got a promise that they're going to have a vote on these ACA, but >> Affordable Care Act, >> Affordable Care Act, the tax credits,
[24:16]the subsidies, but you know what? They still need 60 votes in the Senate. They're never going to get 60 votes. So, they're never going to get a vote to pass it, which means the House is never going to take it up. Not that the
[24:27]speaker would have taken it up anyway, but there's because it's not going to pass in the Senate, it it's done. maximum pressure that was being applied to Republicans coming off of a bad election day, coming off the president
[24:38]who had to go to the Supreme Court to get the Supreme Court to give him permission to not pay out SNAP benefits to potentially starving members um of 40 40 something million Americans who would
[24:49]be impacted by SNAP. >> And you relented the pressure and it it just reflects such a lack of imagination on the part of elected Democrats. And I can't tell you the fissure between
[25:00]elected Democrats and people at home who want to see something different after the same old song. You have sat >> Axelrod said that Schumer is probably done. >> David Ox on [clears throat] another network.
[25:12]>> My constituent, >> right? >> You sat in lots of conversations with House Republicans during shutdowns and you heard from the activist base of your party nashing their teeth, wanting to
[25:24]fight on, wanting to fight on. you I'm sure were a I'm going to assume >> we're a voice to say at some point ladies and gentlemen we have to govern and govern is hard and when you govern and you compromise people are angry but
[25:35]you have to do it at one point or another. >> That's right. That's right. And the Democrats really got nothing out of this thing. I mean, they really get nothing except we had a shutdown that impacted millions of people, whether the air
[25:46]traveler that we just saw in on your tape, uh, or people that are rifted and, you know, air traffic control >> force for nothing. I mean, millions of people were really >> could they have handled it strategically
[25:57]any differently? >> Yeah, I think they >> or do you think they ultimately were going to have to cave and accept these terms no matter what? >> They they should have demanded that they actually get a a vote. I mean, they they
[26:09]may I think they might have asked for too much to begin with versus targeting their approach a little bit narrower. >> Preventing people's health insurance rates from spiking the amount that they're going to spike because of this
[26:19]is just do that is not too much. And I will just say this, Chuck Schumer's problem is this. If he lost control of his moderates, that's a leadership problem. If he organized his moderates to bail him out, that's a leadership
[26:30]problem. And everyone can see right through it regardless of what the story is. And I think that's the issue he's facing right now. Well, let me put to you the question I put to Ted Lou because he kind of sidestepped it and I
[26:40]understand why >> these extended enhanced Obamacare tax credits first showed up in the American Rescue Plan early Biden administration
[26:50]dealing with COVID. Then they came back in the inflation reduction act. >> Democrats were in charge of the entire situation. They set the termination date of December 31st this year. Not
[27:01]Republicans. Democrats did. Don't they owe own that termination date? >> Well, I think they're trying to work with Republicans to do a bipartisan extension of it. But here's actually
[27:13]>> they didn't pass on a bipartisan basis. They passed on a partisan bas here here's the thing I will also say. You know, President Trump and I think Congressman Cole alluded to this had an interesting idea around giving the money
[27:24]directly to constituents to to to people at home to citizens as opposed to insurance companies. I would just say I would not be surprised if you saw that idea get a lot of traction. Um it's
[27:35]gling I think to many on the progressive base that Donald Trump has been able to somewhat outflank Democrats on this. Get to the left of Democrats on the ACA. But
[27:46]be that as it may, I saw Ro Connell on a rival network talking to an anchor who you might not think he'd talk to talking about his desire to work with Donald Trump. I wouldn't be surprised you saw a lot of momentum around that. So, we have
[27:56]to wrap, I'm told, which means we get to eat pizza during the break, which I'm going to do. Joel Payne, Fred Upton, thank you very much. >> Next time >> you bring whatever you want, sir. You have full license to bring whatever you want because you voted against prohibition.
[28:07]>> You deliver the pizza. >> Up next, Pennsylvania Democratic Congressman, ranking member of the House Budget Committee, Brendan [music] Bole, as the House continues debate on the
[28:15]rule. He will join us as that process of debating the rule moves forward on the House [music] and talk about that and assorted matters. You're watching the
[28:25]Takeout. There he is. There he is. [music] Welcome back to Takeout. Continuing our
[28:36]rolling coverage of House deliberation and debate on legislation to the shutdown. Let's listen to the House floor with Alexandria Kazio. Oh no, look at that. That's what happens with live television. She's walking from the podium as soon as I'm willing to throw
[28:48]to her. Well, that's what happens because this is, as I've said many times, an informal program. Fred Upton because he brought the pizza. Still with me. >> Well, go to wide shot. There he is. He's just eating his pizza and he knows
[28:59]Brendan Bole, the Democratic congressman from Pennsylvania, ranking Democrat on the budget committee. Uh, Congressman, it's great to have you with us. Fred is next to me. You might have heard in the earlier segment a moment ago, he said,
[29:10]"Democrats got nothing out of this deal." Is that true? Prove him wrong. >> Well, first, I do hope you save a slice or two for me, or at least end it here.
[29:20]I'll be stuck uh nearby the House floor uh for the next courier to you, sir. >> I would I would appreciate that. But um in a few minutes, we're going to take
[29:31]the first of two different vote series. Um uh the first one, as I said, literally just a few minutes from now, and then the second one probably 7 to
[29:39]7:30. And then I I expect unfortunately um this uh experience will end and the health care of the millions of Americans
[29:49]who will see their costs go up will continue to go unressed. Now um I heard Fred's uh my my friend and former colleague I heard his his comments. I
[30:00]have to say I'm one of those House Democrats. Frankly, I think it's unanimous on this side of of the capital where there is frustration with the uh half a dozen or so Senate Democrats who
[30:11]decided to strike out on their own and strike their own deal and they ended up getting nothing. So, uh it's very disappointing, but at the same time, we'll wake up tomorrow and have to get back to work to figure out how we
[30:23]prevent health care costs from going up for the American people. And let's not forget, and I apologize, it's a little wordy, but let's not forget the reason why we're here talking about healthcare. This all goes back to this summer. What
[30:34]Trump used to call the big beautiful bill that ended up increasing health care costs for millions of people and is projected to throw another 15 million off their healthcare coverage. That's
[30:45]the original sin and why ever since then, this has become front and center as a as an issue. >> Well, Congressman, you said uh tomorrow you'll go back to work. That's not how I understand the House schedule. The
[30:56]speaker said you're out after tonight's vote, so you're not going to be back to work tomorrow. >> Yeah, you know, that is a good clarification. I have to say, I have never seen anything like this. And Fred
[31:08]will remember previous government shutdowns. Um, we were stuck here non-stop, including in week on weekends attempting to find out a bipartisan
[31:19]resolution to move us forward. the unprecedented decision by Republican leadership and the Republican speaker to shut down the House of Representatives. Tonight is the first time I'll be voting
[31:31]and that we will be voting in the House since >> Well, when I talk about a fluid live television situation. There we go. He's back now. You're back. There was a glitch in the system ever so briefly.
[31:42]Congressman, please continue. >> I obviously It's so bad. Not only is Mike Johnson shutting down the house, he's now turning off the lights while I'm not even done. So, um, it is it is
[31:52]absolutely remarkable to me that he decided to put us on a twomonth paid vacation rather than deal with this issue. I think that that is one of the
[32:03]several reasons why Republicans were shellacked last week at the polls in Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Virginia, California, and all states in between. And I think they will continue to pay
[32:14]the price uh at the ballot box over the course of the next year. >> Congressman, hold on one sec cuz I want to ask you about this, Fred. So you just said it was a mistake strategic and otherwise for the house to be on leave absent without leave for seven weeks. You agree with that? Do you think the
[32:25]house should have been in session? >> Yeah, they should have been in session. I can remember during one shutdown we had a very contankerous member of Congress, a colleague Jim Sensen Brener
[32:35]from Wisconsin. He was so angry during a shutdown because we had to be there and he was going to miss a Wisconsin football game that he had bought tickets for. And that was before you could
[32:46]actually do them digitally and and get into the stadium. So he was stuck with the tickets and he was in Washington because we needed to vote to reopen the government, >> right? But to stay in town and do some business, whatever it is, they should
[32:57]stay here. >> All right. Well, you at least agree on that. Uh, Congressman, I want to ask this question I've been asking every Democrat tonight. You guys, meaning you Democrats, when you passed the extended
[33:08]Obamacare tax credits during COVID, you set a termination date. The termination date was established by you and President Biden. Don't you own some of that?
[33:20]>> No. I I heard that earlier and and I'm glad I have the opportunity to respond. That's just the way that things are done around here. By that same logic, the Republican tax cuts, they own the fact
[33:30]that they will expire at some point in the future because of the complex rules of budgeting here and 10-year windows and trying to make the score work. that is pretty routine with the expectation
[33:42]that a future Congress will of course renew this which typically takes place. So I do take issue with that. Um the reality is once these went into effect,
[33:53]no one really had the idea that they were going to expire. It became the new normal. And I want to remind folks exactly what we're talking about here in terms of the ramifications to the American people.
[34:04]>> Congressman, I got to go. I got to go. I hope the speaker doesn't turn the lights off anymore. I promise you we will courier one way or another. One, two, maybe four slices of pizza in your direction. I appreciate the time. Thanks so much.
[34:15]>> Debate continues on the House floor. Our reporter panel standing by to weigh in and maybe get some of that pizza. I just don't know. You're watching the Take. [music]
[34:31]Welcome back to Takeout. I want to bring in our reporter Danielle Diaz covers Congress for notice. That's news of the US and Sabrina Rodriguez, national politics reporter for the Washington Post. Pizza's still here. You're having some pizza. That's good. You're waiting for Thai food on Capitol Hill. I
[34:43]understand that. Just means more pizza for Brendan Bole, which we'll get to in one way or the other. Uh, there's a phrase in Washington, everything's been said, but not everyone said it. So, say
[34:54]what you want to say about the end of the shutdown. Danielle, >> it's the longest shutdown in US history. and we were just talking behind. I can't steal any of uh Sabrina's amazing talking points, but really [laughter] I
[35:05]her argument was Democrats didn't get anything really from this deal. Please feel free to interrupt me, but it's I always thought it was going to end up this way because Republicans made very clear where they were from the very beginning.
[35:17]>> Not budging. >> Not budging and they didn't budge. >> Yeah. I mean, I think what's interesting here was Democrats, you know, knowing that the American people want them to fight, knowing that the Democratic base
[35:28]wanted to see some type of fight, Democrats leaned into that and essentially agreed that, okay, we'll let Americans feel a little bit of pain so they can see this is the consequence of this administration, >> get through no kings, get through the
[35:40]election, cave, >> but then you cave. So ultimately, people look back now and say, "Well, what did you get out of it?" And again, I think it's hard to show any kind of deliverable other than us getting to square one, which would have happened if
[35:51]they had voted for the CR in the first place. >> The Democrats I've talked to admit all those things, but also say, but look, in the intervening time, there was this
[36:01]elevation of healthcare and the Trump administration's approach to a shutdown, trying to fire as many federal workers as possible, petition the Supreme Court to suspend
[36:11]SNAP benefits, those sorts of things have a larger resonance. Do you think there's any validity to that? >> I think on the snap front, I think people seeing firsthand what the Trump
[36:21]administration has done and specifically that fight in the courts, them repeatedly pushing back on distributing those SNAP benefits. I think that is something that is on people's mind and we'll be hearing, you know, in campaign
[36:33]ad after campaign ad heading toward the midterms. >> And Danielle, in the spirit of Fred Upton, uh, next time you're here, just bring some Thai food, okay? [laughter] Would that be all right? No. Uh, very quickly, uh, Jeffrey Epstein, the revelations or the releases, maybe
[36:45]they're revelations, maybe they're not, from the Democrats on the House Oversight Committee. We've got the 218th signature, meaning the discharge petition is frozen. It's going to move
[36:56]forward procedurally in the House. This issue is not going away. >> It's not going away. And it's also very timely, too, that this is happening on the same day as the end of the government shutdown. House Democrats
[37:06]really planned that release very well this morning with changing the Yeah, >> Mary Telegraph, but it's it's always been in the background of what's been happening in the government shutdown.
[37:16]I've written countless stories during this government shutdown about how the Epstein files were not going away. And of course, the day that the House is voting on this, they're back. And in seven legislative days, so it could be
[37:27]two weeks from now, we're going to see potentially a floor vote on the House. And we're going to see more Republicans than we think potentially voting for that with Democrats. >> Sabrina, your thoughts? I just spent my
[37:39]day going through the files. A big fullcourt effort at the post today of of trying to go through the >> whole readers where you have everyone reading and >> and everyone's going through and trying
[37:49]to put together what they've seen. >> And of course, I think in the headlines, people have seen, you know, the top line seeing, you know, Epstein say that Trump knew in an email and and all of that. But I just think in the weeks to come,
[38:00]that's going to occupy a lot of our attention the way that it has for the American public. And again, I think it's just a dizzying day between the shutdown ending and the Epstein files out. >> One of many dizzying days in Washington
[38:11]these days. [laughter] Sabrina Rodriguez, Daniela Diaz, you bring some sanity to the dizzyingness and I appreciate that very much. We're going to take a quick break. The takeout special coverage of the House vote as it works through it and the government
[38:22]shutdown rolls on. We'll be right back. [music] Welcome back to the Takeout and our
[38:33]continuing coverage of the shutdown which is nearing an end. Joining me, Republican Maryland Congressman Andy Harris. It's good to see you, Congressman. I appreciate it. You lead the Freedom Caucus when the House
[38:43]leadership needs to know that it can get ticklish legislation crossed. The finish line, it checks with you first. Will there be the vote sufficient to pass this tonight? And why? >> Uh, I believe there will. I think
[38:55]America's put up enough with this uh with this shutdown. I think uh you know a handful of rational Democrats came through in the Senate. I think a handful are going to join us in the House and we'll get the government reopened by tomorrow morning.
[39:06]>> Anything that you perceive in this that constitutes a Republican victory? >> Well, look, uh we got level funding which I think is great uh in an era when we have to begin controlling our
[39:17]deficits. That's that's pretty good. I think moving it past January 1st, the uh new deadline means that we're not going to see the Christmas omnibus bill. I think that's pretty good. And we we got
[39:27]three uh appropriations bills negotiated at basically last year's funding level. I think that's pretty good. Uh so fiscally, this this is a good bill and uh we need to get the government reopened and we're going to do it in
[39:38]just a couple hours. >> Congressman, correct me if I'm wrong. When you said that they'll be funded at last year's level, aren't those Biden levels? Uh well, except that the policies are
[39:49]going to be determined by the Trump administration. So uh yes, they are Biden levels, but we think the first thing you have to do is let's let's freeze the uh the uh the budget before we begin to trim it. And obviously the
[40:01]President Trump and Russ vote are trimming the budget. >> And are you pleased or displeased that part of this deal is to rehire all of
[40:11]the federal workers who were fired by the Trump administration during the shutdown? Well, look, that that's just part of the deal. Uh I always felt that the courts might might actually force them to be
[40:22]rehired anyway. And again, you know, you you've reduced the federal workforce by 150,000. Whether or not an additional 4,000 are there this month or not in that reduction uh probably doesn't make
[40:32]that much difference. articulate for my audience, if you' be so kind, Congressman, your opinion about whether or not Obamacare
[40:42]subsidies enhanced during CO under the Biden administration should be in any way, shape, or form extended. Well, they certainly shouldn't be extended in the current form. There's rampant waste and abuse with it. Uh
[40:54]hundreds of uh billions of dollars went to straight to insurance companies which make hundreds of billion dollars in profit. So, no, you can't extend it the way it is. Could we have a negotiation that uh that helps some of those people
[41:06]but also helps the other 93% of Americans who have problems with health care premiums? Sure, we we we might be able to come to a deal, but we got to deal with all people's problems with healthcare insurance premiums, not just
[41:17]the 7% who are on Obamacare. But this program had Ted Lou on it earlier and he said that's a false argument because employer-based insurance subsidizes
[41:29]those who have employerbased insurance. And what Obamacare does, because you don't have employer based insurance, you're by yourself, you're on your lonesome, you need to have some level of subsidy. How do you deal with that argument?
[41:40]>> Oh, that's absolutely right. And in fact, the private employer subsidizes an average 80% of the premium. And before COVID, Obamacare subsidized an average 80% of the premium. So all it's doing is
[41:51]restoring this to pre-COVID levels that are basically identical to what you see with private employers. So Miss Lou is absolutely right. we that we should have the same level and that's exactly what we're going to have.
[42:03]>> Congressman, what is your reaction to the release by the House Democrats on the oversight committee with these documents and emails in the Epstein matter and how they relate to President
[42:13]Trump way back when? >> Well, I got to tell you, it's very clever redactions they uh used. Of course, when you see the original unredacted uh versions, they have an entirely different point of view. Uh,
[42:25]look, uh, I I have no problems with thing with things being released. What I do have a problem with is when you release something and you redact something purposefully to mislead people. And that's exactly what the Democrats did on oversight.
[42:36]>> Would not then therefore, Congressman, the solution for the Trump administration be to release everything in the Justice Department and the Treasury Department's possession, which is a lot? >> Look, I I'm not I don't sit on that
[42:47]committee. All I know is tens of thousands of pages have been released. Uh, I don't know how much more there is to release. Uh but again, we we'll have that discussion in the next couple of weeks and we'll we'll see what needs to
[42:58]be what hasn't been released yet and what has. >> And very quickly, 15 seconds. You're satisfied with how the Trump administration has handled this thus far. >> Uh yeah, absolutely. I mean that we need
[43:10]to protect people who are innocent. >> Got it. Congressman Andy Harris, I appreciate it. Thank you so much. That does it for the Takeout tonight, but not for CBS News 247. Stick with us for continuous coverage [music] of the House
[43:22]vote to end the government shutdown. The daily report is next. [music]
[43:38]>> [music]